Public transcript

Joe Rogan Experience #2560 - David Grusch

By: The Joe Rogan Experience
Length: 2 h 30 min
Language: English
Text from: the video's captions
Transcribed: 6 October 2026

Read the full transcript Open on YouTube

Notes in English.

Summary

David Grusch returns to the Joe Rogan Experience to discuss his time as a congressional staffer for Representative Burlson, the criminal activity he says he uncovered while investigating UAP programs, and his belief that full disclosure will happen before Trump leaves office. He describes seeing contemporary video of dead non-human entities from a retrieval, discusses multiple types of craft and beings including 'Greek god'-like figures and reptilians, and claims NHI-versus-NHI conflict has been documented. He also addresses threats made against him, the 2004 disclosure war-game assessment, and why he believes the phenomenon is real and not a cover for secret human technology.

Key points

Grusch says he was hired by Representative Burlson as congressional staff after testifying as a whistleblower, the first person ever to do so, and recently finished about a year and a half in that role.
He says he uncovered a criminal enterprise run out of a particular agency, including child trafficking under the cover of national security programs, and worked with DOJ on it.
Grusch says he was told in a Senate Intel committee skiff meeting that particular individuals wanted to kill him, and that the plan was kiboshed.
He says he saw contemporary video of three or four dead, very human-looking, 'beautiful' entities with long grayish hair recovered from a crash, and independently verified the event.
He claims there are multiple types of beings — grays of several subtypes, reptilian types, and 'Greek god' or Nordic-looking ones — and that NHI-versus-NHI conflict, such as reptilians versus grays, has been documented.
He says US personnel killed surviving reptilians after they posed a threat and US personnel were hurt and died.
He believes Trump is serious about disclosure and that it must happen before he leaves office, ideally at least six months before the election.
He says a 2004 assessment for the Bush administration recommended against disclosure mainly due to federal contract fraud and misappropriation of funds.
He describes a large underwater base of operations, multiple city blocks in size, with stuff coming and going, origin unknown.
He denies Matthew Brown's allegation that he tricked him into becoming a whistleblower, saying he never met Brown until 2024 and never saw the briefing in question.

Questions it answers

00:00Return and congressional work

What has David Grusch been doing since his last appearance?

He was hired by Representative Burlson as congressional professional staff after testifying as a whistleblower — the first person ever to do both — and worked about a year and a half before recently winding down.

He calls the last several years "living a nightmare."
He says much of his work for Congress was private and behind the scenes.
He believes the US is at a poignant moment with Trump's declassification push.

02:06Criminal enterprise uncovered

What criminal activity did Grusch find while investigating UAP programs?

He says he bumped into a criminal enterprise run out of a particular agency, including child trafficking under the cover of national security programs, and worked with DOJ on it. He compares it to the ecosystem of a CIA officer arrested with $40 million in gold bars from a fake continuity of government program.

He briefed members of Congress on the details in classified settings.
He says he received kudos in a brief to Kash Patel about it.
He distinguishes between patriotic program personnel and a small cast of criminal actors.

09:00Retaliation and death threat

What happened to Grusch after he got too close?

He says he was administratively attacked in October 2020, people around him were targeted, and in early 2022 he received a message that they could touch him and his wife. In a Senate Intel committee skiff meeting, he was told particular individuals wanted to kill him, but the plan was kiboshed.

He says he was investigated by three agencies and kept his top secret clearance.
People helping him experienced Havana syndrome-type symptoms in 2021.
He still doesn't know exactly which tripwire he crossed.

23:00Trump and the disclosure path

Does Grusch believe disclosure will actually happen?

Yes — he says Trump wants it out, Steven Miller is serious but being blocked, and he believes everything he testified about will come out before Trump leaves office, ideally at least six months before the election.

He met Miller briefly at a UFC event at the White House, who told him it's going to come out.
He says if Trump doesn't enforce his order, no other president will be able to.
He warns of a slow rollout due to diplomatic, theological, and third-party risks.

34:00The 2004 assessment

Why did previous administrations decide not to disclose?

Grusch describes a November 2004 war-game-style assessment sponsored by Steve Hadley where negatives outweighed positives, with the main concern being federal contract fraud and misappropriation of funds through sole-source contracts.

He verified the meeting took place with other attendees.
AARO's volume one report admitted the meeting occurred but called it hypothetical.
He says disclosure could trigger a golden era of innovation by opening the topic to academia.

58:00The dead entities video

What is the most compelling thing Grusch personally saw?

Contemporary video from a retrieval operation showing three or four dead entities that looked very human — beautiful, pale/albino, bluish-white skin, long grayish hair — which he independently verified through other sources and methods.

He sat on the material for years to rule out deception or a limited hangout.
The bodies are kept for analysis in some preservation status.
He connects their appearance to General McCaslin's "think of the Greek gods" remark.

1:11:00Grays, reptilians, and NHI conflict

What types of beings does Grusch describe?

He describes grays with three or four subtypes, reptilian beings seven-foot-plus with scaly gorilla-like skin, and Nordic/Greek-god-looking beings. He says NHI-versus-NHI conflict has been documented, including a crash with dead grays and reptilians.

The reptilian craft was tic-tac shaped; the Greek-god beings favor boomerang/crescent craft.
He estimates at least a dozen or two adversarial conflict crashes.
He says some craft appear to have been deliberately "donated," raising Trojan-horse concerns.

2:04:00The reptilian firefight

What happened to the living reptilians from the crash?

Grusch says they were killed by US personnel after posing a threat, with US personnel hurt and dying in the fight. He hopes the people who were there will speak publicly someday.

He says the reptilians were mortal.
He acknowledges the story sounds crazy even to him.
He stresses he's relaying secondhand knowledge from credible sources.

Notes

Background and Congressional Work

David Grusch testified before Congress as a whistleblower and was then hired by Representative Burlson as professional staff, the first whistleblower ever to subsequently be hired by Congress.
He spent about a year and a half working for Burlson, recently winding down, and describes the last several years as "living a nightmare."

Criminal Activity Uncovered

Grusch says he bumped into a criminal enterprise run out of a particular agency, including child trafficking under the cover of national security programs, and worked with DOJ on it.
He references the case of a CIA officer arrested with roughly $40 million in gold bars (about 303 one-kilogram bars) obtained through a fake continuity of government special access program.

Personal Retaliation and Threats

After joining the UAP task force in 2019, he says he was "administratively nuked" in October 2020, with colleagues and superiors targeted as well.
In early 2022 he received a message that people could "touch" him and his wife; weeks later, in an off-books Senate Intel committee meeting, he was told particular individuals wanted to kill him, and that the plan was kiboshed.

Disclosure and Trump

Grusch believes Trump is showing courage in ordering the government to release everything, and that disclosure will happen before his term ends — ideally at least six months before the election.
He cites Steven Miller being blocked from access and the declassification of a 1952 Blue Book-era recording from MIT Lincoln Labs describing objects near nuclear sites moving an estimated 3,500 miles per hour.
A 2004 assessment for the Bush administration reportedly recommended against disclosure mainly due to federal contract fraud and misappropriation of funds tied to sole-source contracts.

Beings and Craft

Grusch says he saw contemporary video of three or four dead entities from a retrieval: very human-looking, "beautiful," pale/albino, bluish-white skin, long grayish hair, wearing form-fitting clothing.
He describes multiple types: grays (several subtypes, tall and small), reptilian types (seven-foot-plus, scaly, gorilla-like), and "Greek god"/Nordic-looking beings associated with boomerang or crescent-moon craft.
He claims NHI-versus-NHI conflict has been documented, including a crash with dead grays and reptilians, and that US personnel killed surviving reptilians after they posed a threat, with US personnel hurt and dying.
He discusses theories about orbs as sentient plasmoids or craft with plasma sheaths from magnetohydrodynamic propulsion.