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W EXCLUSIVELY AT THE TABLE,
ALEX KARP, PALANTIR'S CO-FOUNDER AND

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CEO. AND CNBC'S SEEMA MODY, WHO

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COVERS PALANTIR, JOINS US.
AND TELL US ABOUT TELL US ABOUT THE

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DEAL WITH. THERE'S SO MANY
THINGS I THINK WE ALL WANT TO

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TALK ABOUT, BUT BUT LET'S
GET TO THE NVIDIA DEAL FIRST.

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>> BECAUSE I HAVE SO MUCH
RESPECT FOR NVIDIA AND JENSEN

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HUANG. I'M GOING TO TRY TO KEEP
THIS MORE ADULT THAN I USUALLY

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DO. BUT THE TRUTH IS,
IF YOU WANT TO KNOW HOW THIS CAME

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TOGETHER, FROM MY PERSPECTIVE,
IT WAS IT WAS THERE ARE A LOT

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OF TECHNICAL ISSUES. WHO CONTROLS
THE MODELS, WHO CONTROLS THE WEIGHTS? WHO

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CONTROLS THE VALUE OF YOUR BUSINESS?
BUT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE,

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WE'RE, WE'RE SITTING
ON CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE ACROSS

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AMERICA, UKRAINE, ISRAEL,
EVERYONE WHO USES LLMS ON THE

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BATTLEFIELD RUNS ON TOP OF OUR

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ONTOLOGY. AND OUR CLIENTS ARE
JUST TO SAY THEY'RE UNHAPPY

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WITH THE FRONTIER LABS IS TO SAY, I'M
WELCOME AT THE BERKELEY FACULTY. IT'S LIKE

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THERE'S JUST A LEVEL
OF DISCOMFORT AND LOSS OF TRUST

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THAT ALSO MADE IT. IT REALLY, REALLY.

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>> UNPACK THAT. WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT?

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>> WELL, YOU HAVE OKAY.
SO WHEN YOU'RE WHEN YOU'RE USING LARGE

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LANGUAGE MODELS, THEY ARE.
IT'S LIKE A. AT THIS POINT, EVERYONE

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TECHNICAL REALIZES THEY'RE
LIKE A CRITICAL RESOURCE TO MAKE

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THEM VALUABLE IN AN ENTERPRISE
LIKE BATTLEFIELD CONTEXT OR

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REGULATED CONTEXT OR MANUFACTURING, YOU
HAVE TO HAVE WHAT'S CALLED AN APPLICATION

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LAYER. AND WE, WE HAVE THIS
THING CALLED ONTOLOGY THAT NOW

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EVERYONE'S COPYING, BUT DE FACTO, IT
TAKES A LARGE LANGUAGE MODEL. IT MAKES IT

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SAFE AND USEFUL AND PRECISE.
SO SAFE BECAUSE IT DOESN'T TOUCH

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YOUR UNDERLYING DATA,
SAFE BECAUSE IT PREVENTS THE LARGE

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LANGUAGE MODEL FROM CACHING
YOUR DATA AND REPLICATING YOUR

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BUSINESS SAFE BECAUSE IT
DOESN'T TRANSFER YOUR IP OF HOW

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TO FIGHT SECRET DATA,
TOP SECRET DATA, OR IN A CLINICAL

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CONTEXT. SO THE GENERAL WAY
THESE THINGS WERE SOLD, AND

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AGAIN, THESE PEOPLE ARE SAM AND,
AND DARIO, THERE'S NOTHING MORE

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FUN THAN DEBATING DARIO IN PRIVATE.
SO THIS IS I'M NOT

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THROWING SHADE AT THEM.
BUT SOMETHING HAS GONE COMPLETELY

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WRONG. AND THE BASIC VIEW AMONG

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ENTERPRISES IN THIS COUNTRY
IS I'M GOING TO CHILL LAX AND

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WASTE MY TIME WITH TOKENS.
I'M GOING TO GET NO VALUE AND

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THEY'RE GOING TO GET MY IP.
>> NOW THAT SOUNDS LIKE SHADE.

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OKAY. AND NOT TO SHADE.
IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU'RE SAYING THESE.

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>> NO, NO NO, NO, THIS IS REPORTING.

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>> OKAY. >> AND THIS IS REPORTING
THAT I'VE, I'VE LITERALLY AGAINST MY

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OWN INTEREST CALLED THESE ARE
LIKE, I'M PROFITING FROM THIS,

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RIGHT? SO THE REALITY IS YOU
MAY NOT LIKE US AT MY FORMER

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SCHOOL, HAVERFORD OR BERKELEY,
BUT ENTERPRISES IN THIS COUNTRY

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TRUST AND LOVE US, ESPECIALLY
ONES THAT ARE INVOLVED IN

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CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE,
BOTH PUBLIC AND PRIVATE. OKAY, SO I

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WANT FOR THOSE COUNTRIES,
WE'RE COMING UP TO JULY 4TH. I WANT

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THOSE I WANT FOR US AND OUR,
OUR, OUR, OUR, OUR, OUR FRIENDS

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ACROSS THE GLOBE TO HAVE
THE VERY BEST TECH RESOURCES. IN

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FACT, THE WHOLE SECRET OF PALANTIR IS
THE FORWARD DEPLOYED MODEL, THE PRODUCTS

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THAT HAVE BEEN FIVE YEARS AHEAD.

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YOU KNOW, YOU'VE BEEN WITH ME
FOR A LONG TIME. EVERYONE,

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EVERYONE, EVERYONE SAID PHDS
WERE SERVICES. THEY SAID, WE

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DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT AN ONTOLOGY IS.
THAT'S THE ONLY

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THING PEOPLE TALK ABOUT. NOW.
THE SECRET WAS WE DELIVERED THE

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BEST THINGS FOR THE WARFIGHTERS.

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THOSE WARFIGHTERS HAVE SERIOUS
TRUST ISSUES, BUT IT'S NOT JUST

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THE WAR VIS A VIS FRONTIER LABS.

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THEN YOU HAVE MY ENTERPRISES
IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR WHO HAVE THE

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SAME ISSUES, LIKE WHY WOULD
THEY GET ACCESS TO MY DATA IF

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THEY'RE GOING TO BUILD MY ALPHA?

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WHY WOULDN'T I CONTROL THE WEIGHTS? WHY
WOULDN'T? AND THAT'S WHERE YOU GET THIS

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PARTNERSHIP. WHAT ALIGNS ME

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WITH NVIDIA AND I THINK IS WHAT

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THE TECHNICAL CUSTOMERS WANT,

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WHICH IS CONTROL OVER THEIR

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COMPUTE, THEIR MODELS, THEIR

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DATA STACK AND THEIR ALPHA.
THEY WANT TO KNOW THEY OWN THE

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MEANS OF PRODUCTION.
IT'S NOT BEING TRANSFERRED TO SOMEONE

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ELSE. THEY'RE NOT INTERESTED
IN SOME FAKE DEPLOY CODE THAT

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SOMEHOW IS DEPLOYING TOKENS,
THAT TRANSFERS THE ALPHA TO A

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THIRD PARTY AND THE JIG IS UP.

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AND SO WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT
A WAY BOTH, BOTH OUR OUR PRODUCTS

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ARE AGNOSTIC. WE, WE NOW SELL
A PRODUCT TO CUSTOMERS THAT

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ALLOWS YOU TO SWITCH FROM MODEL
TO MODEL BECAUSE. AND WE'RE

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COMPLETELY AGNOSTIC, BUT WE
NEED TO REBUILD TRUST. AND THAT

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TRUST IS GOING TO HAPPEN WHERE
EVERYONE GETS TO ASK, ASK AND

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ANSWER BASIC QUESTIONS.
WHO OWNS THE DATA? WHERE IS IT

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CACHED? ARE THE PROMPTS SECURE?

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IS THIS BEING TRANSFERRED TO YOU?
ARE YOU BEING OKAY? IF IT

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WAS SO VALUABLE, LET'S SAY I CAN MAKE YOU
$1 BILLION TOMORROW. WOULDN'T I SAY I'LL

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MAKE YOU $1 BILLION AND I WANT 30%.
WHY ARE THEY CHARGING FOR

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TOKENS IF IT'S SO VALUABLE?
>> SO THEN, ALEX, IF THE KEY,

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FROM WHAT I'M HEARING YOU SAY,
IS A SECURE, AMERICAN BORN OPEN

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SOURCE MODEL, HOW QUICKLY CAN
YOUR MODEL COMPETE WITH THE FRONTIER?

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>> WELL, KNOW WHAT.
>> I'M SAYING IS. AND AGENTIC AI.

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>> OKAY, WHAT I'M CLAIMING,
OBVIOUSLY SLIGHTLY TRUE, BUT

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SLIGHTLY SELF-CENTERED IS IT'S

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THE MODEL PLUS AN APPLICATION
LAYER PLUS COMPUTE. IT IS

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REALLY ALL THREE.
SO IN OUR JARGON, IT'S THE VALUE, THE

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REASON. OKAY, JUST LOOK
AT OUR FINANCIALS. THE REASON WHY

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EVERYONE IS CHILLAXING WITH BAD
FINANCIALS AND GROWTH WITH

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LOSING MONEY IS THE CLIENT
REFUSES TO PAY THE TRUE COST.

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THE TWO PLACES THAT ACTUALLY
MAKE MONEY, LIKE PROFIT FREE

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CASH FLOW ARE OUR APPLICATION
LAYER CALLED ONTOLOGY AND

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COMPUTE. OKAY, WHAT?
I AM NOT JUST CLAIMING WE CAN TAKE AN

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OPEN MODEL AND IN THE
CLASSIFIED OR NON-CLASSIFIED

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CONTEXT, GET IT TO THE POINT
OF A FRONTIER MODEL, BUT A YOU

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CONTROL THE WEIGHTS.
SO WHAT IS THE TRUE COST? NOT JUST WHAT

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YOU'RE PAYING. THE TRUE COST
IS NOT JUST IS WHAT YOU MAKE MINUS

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WHAT YOU LOSE, MEANING THE VALUE
OF YOUR BUSINESS. BUT WE

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CAN GET THE THE FRONTIER
APPLICATION TO BE EXACTLY THE

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SAME AS A FRONTIER MODEL, WITHOUT
THE RISK OF TRANSFERRING THE ALPHA OF YOUR

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BUSINESS TO ANOTHER.
BY THE WAY, YOU COULD DO THIS WITH A

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FRONTIER CLOSED MODEL TOO,
BUT THEN THE CLIENTS HAVE TO BE

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ABLE TO ASK AND ANSWER A VERY
BASIC QUESTIONS. ARE YOU

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KEEPING THE DATA? ARE YOU GOING
TO ENTER OUR BUSINESS? WHAT DO

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YOU IN THE CLASSIFIED CONTEXT,
WHEN THE DEPARTMENT OF WAR GOES

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TO YOU AND SAYS, I NEED
THIS APPLICATION, DO THEY GET TO

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CONTROL THE WEIGHTS TO DO IT,
OR DO YOU GET TO CONTROL THE

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WEIGHTS? ARE WE REALLY GOING
TO OUTSOURCE THE BATTLEFIELD OF

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THIS COUNTRY TO THE CONSENSUS
VIEW IN SILICON VALLEY? THAT IS

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EFFING INSANE. AND BY THE WAY,
EVERY SINGLE ENTERPRISE IN THIS

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COUNTRY IN PRIVATE, A LOT
OF THEM DON'T WANT TO SPEAK IN

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PUBLIC BECAUSE IT GETS IT GETS OUTSOURCED
TO THE NEURODIVERGENT, CRAZY PERSON

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THAT APPARENTLY IS ON DRUGS.
THE ONE THING I DON'T DO IT.

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OKAY, SO THAT'S MY ROLE.
BUT I'M TELLING YOU, IN THIS

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COUNTRY, AT EVERY SINGLE
ENTERPRISE I DEAL WITH, THESE

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PEOPLE ARE LIVID. THEY'RE LIKE,
I AM PAYING FOR TOKENS THAT

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CREATE NO VALUE. THESE PEOPLE ARE STEALING
THE WEIGHTS IN ALPHA OF MY BUSINESS, AND

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THEY'RE CREATING A WEALTH TAX
THAT DOES NOT HELP THE POOR. IT

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JUST PUNISHES.
STARTS WITH THE BILLIONAIRES. EVERY SINGLE

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PERSON AT THIS TABLE IS GOING
TO BE PAYING A WEALTH TAX ONLY

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TO PUNISH US. AND THE REASON
FOR IT IS BECAUSE THESE MODELS

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HAVE BEEN COMPLETELY OVER,
IRRESPONSIBLY OVERSOLD. AND THE

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SALE IS IT'S DANGEROUS
FOR EVERYONE, WHICH IS WHY I CAN

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GIVE IT TO ALL YOUR ADVERSARIES,
BUT I CAN'T GIVE IT TO THE

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DEPARTMENT OF WAR OR I CAN'T
SAFELY GIVE IT TO AN ENTERPRISE

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IN THIS COUNTRY WITHOUT BEING
CERTAIN THAT THE ALPHA OF THAT

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BUSINESS COULD TRANSFER TO THIS MODEL
TOMORROW. I HAVE NO BUSINESS. NO JOB.

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>> YOU SOUND PRETTY ANGRY.
>> NO, THE. THIS IS THE VOICE

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OF AMERICAN BUSINESS THAT IS
BEING CHANNELED THROUGH ME. AND

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I'M TELLING YOU, IT IS.
IT IS ABSOLUTELY A PROBLEM FOR THIS

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COUNTRY, BECAUSE WE ARE ON THE
CUTTING EDGE OF EVERY SINGLE AI

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TECHNOLOGY. BUT IF YOU'RE GOING
TO TRIPOLI, OVERSELL SOMETHING.

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AND AND BY THE WAY, THE ENTERPRISES ARE
JUST TIRED OF IT. BUT BY THE WAY, JUST A

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MINUTE. I WANT YOU, EVERYBODY
WATCHING THIS TO TEST WHAT I'M

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SAYING, ESPECIALLY INVESTORS
WHO THINK SOMEHOW THIS IS

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WORKING, PICK UP THE PHONE
AND CALL A CEO IN PRIVATE, NOT IN

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PUBLIC. EVERY SINGLE PERSON
HERE CAN DO THIS. CALL 2 OR 3

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AND SAY, MADMAN KARP IS ON TV
SAYING, WE'RE LIVID. I'M NOT

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GOING TO QUOTE YOU. YOU KNOW,
I WON'T QUOTE YOU. YOU HAVE A

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HISTORY. AND SEE, THEY'RE
TWICE AS LIVID AS ME. LIKE.

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>> SO IF YOU'RE RIGHT, THOUGH,
DOES THAT MEAN THAT WE ARE

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LIVING IN SOME KIND OF TERRIBLE
AI BUBBLE AND THAT WE'RE GOING

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TO, IN A QUARTER OR 2 OR 3
QUARTERS FROM NOW, WE'RE GOING

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TO HEAR THAT BIG ENTERPRISES ARE CANCELING
THEIR SUBSCRIPTIONS TO THESE PRODUCTS,

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OR THAT THEY BUILD OUT
IS GOING TO SLOW BECAUSE.

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>> THIS IS THIS IS THE TRAGEDY

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OF IT. THE REALITY OF COMPUTE

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PLUS ONTOLOGY PLUS MODEL CHANGE

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IS CHANGING THE COURSE OF HISTORY.
ASK THE UKRAINIANS,

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ASK THE ISRAELIS, ASK OUR DEPARTMENT OF
WAR. ASK THE ENTERPRISES THAT ARE WORKING.

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WE DO NOT HAVE TO OVERSELL WHAT
WE HAVE. WE HAVE. AND IT'S ALL

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BEING BUILT IN THIS COUNTRY,
BASICALLY, EXCEPT FOR THE OPEN

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MODELS, WHICH IS A REAL THING
COMING FROM CHINA, EXCEPT FOR

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NVIDIA OPEN MODELS, WHICH ARE
WORLD CLASS. BASICALLY, IT'S

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ALL BEING BUILT HERE.
WE DO NOT HAVE TO OVERHYPE. WE DO NOT

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HAVE TO OVERHYPE IT TO THE POINT
WHERE WE'RE GOING TO HAVE

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WEALTH TAX, PUNISHING THE WEALTH.

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>> IF THEY'RE CHARGING
THE ENTERPRISE THREE TIMES AS MUCH

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AS THEY SHOULD BE. YEAH.
AND THEN AND THEN THEY HAVE TO PULL

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BACK ON THAT. THAT CHANGES
THE MATH OF ALL OF THIS.

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>> WHO'S THE THEY. >> LIKE THE LARGE
LANGUAGE MODELS, WHICH BY THE WAY,

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IMPACTS YOUR PARTNER NVIDIA BECAUSE.

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>> THEY SORRY, I'M TALKING
ABOUT THE THEY, THE ENTERPRISES

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THAT POWER THIS COUNTRY
AS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING YOU'RE

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TALKING ABOUT. THE THEY
AS FRONTIER LABS IN SILICON VALLEY.

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THAT'S GREAT. I'M FOCUSED
ON THE ENTERPRISES OF THIS.

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>> COUNTRY, HYPERSCALERS. >> WELL, YOU
KNOW, IT IT DEPENDS WHAT THEY'RE SELLING.

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THAT'S VERY, VERY DOWNSTREAM
FROM US. WE'RE COMPLETELY

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AGNOSTIC. WE PREFER A WORLD WHERE THERE
ARE MORE HYPERSCALERS, WHERE THERE'S ALL

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SORTS OF NEW HYPERSCALERS. ELON,
NVIDIA, WE LIKE THAT WORLD. WHY

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DO WE LIKE THE WORLD?
THE SAME REASON WHEN YOU GO ONLINE AND

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THERE'S, YOU KNOW, THERE'S 50
KINDS OF KINDS OF COATS. YOU

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00:09:49,820 --> 00:09:53,507
GET TO PICK THE ONE YOU LIKE.
BUT WHAT IS HAPPENING AMONG THE

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MOST TECHNICAL PLAYERS IS THEY'RE SAYING,
I WANT SOMETHING I OWN. THIS IS MY

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BUSINESS. I WANT TO OWN THE GPUS.
I WANT TO OWN MY DATA. I

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00:10:01,500 --> 00:10:04,387
WANT TO OWN THE MODEL.
I WANT TO CONTROL THE ALPHA.

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>> SO IS THAT CREATING MORE
MORE OPPORTUNITY FOR. ARE YOU

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00:10:07,470 --> 00:10:10,327
ALREADY SEEING THE GOVERNMENT
CANCEL CONTRACTS WITH ANTHROPIC

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00:10:10,410 --> 00:10:13,267
AND OPENAI AND SAYING, WE.
>> WANT TO WORK. WE'RE NOT HERE.

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00:10:13,350 --> 00:10:16,737
>> LITERALLY NOT HERE TO TALK
ABOUT WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN TO

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A VERY IMPORTANT BUSINESS
IN THE COUNTRY, EXCEPT FOR,

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00:10:19,350 --> 00:10:21,107
OBVIOUSLY, TO SOME EXTENT, MINE.

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IN MY BUSINESS, WE HAVE MUCH
MORE DEMAND THAN WE CAN SUPPLY.

188
00:10:25,560 --> 00:10:30,077
THAT'S LIKE AND AND BY THE WAY,
IT MAY BE SOMEWHAT MAYBE, MAYBE

189
00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:32,577
THE CRAZY PERSON THAT STILL
ONLY CARES ABOUT FREE CASH FLOW,

190
00:10:32,660 --> 00:10:36,587
BUT WE HAVE MORE BUSINESS THAN
WE CAN SUPPLY. AND WE HAVE LOOK,

191
00:10:36,670 --> 00:10:38,357
IF YOU JUST LOOK AT OUR

192
00:10:38,440 --> 00:10:43,857
FINANCIALS, YOU CAN SEE LIKE
A TWO YEARS OUT, YOU CAN SEE 15,

193
00:10:43,940 --> 00:10:45,057
$18 BILLION IN FREE CASH FLOW.

194
00:10:45,140 --> 00:10:47,967
>> SORRY, LIKE FRUSTRATED BY THE
STOCK'S PERFORMANCE OVER THE LAST.

195
00:10:48,050 --> 00:10:51,067
>> YOU KNOW WHAT? I'VE BEEN
AT THIS FOR 20 YEARS. WE'VE BEEN

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00:10:51,150 --> 00:10:53,867
AT THIS TALKING THIS WHEN WE
FIRST STARTED TALKING, PEOPLE

197
00:10:53,950 --> 00:10:57,807
WERE LIKE, IS THIS A SERVICES
COMPANY? IS IT WORTHLESS? YEAH.

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00:10:57,890 --> 00:11:01,807
THE MARKETS ARE SHORT TERM,
VERY FICKLE. AND ALSO, QUITE

199
00:11:01,890 --> 00:11:05,377
FRANKLY, WHERE I WOULD THROW
SOME SHADE, WHAT INVESTORS

200
00:11:05,460 --> 00:11:09,287
ACTUALLY UNDERSTAND TECH,
THEY THINK BECAUSE THEY'RE VERY HIGH

201
00:11:09,370 --> 00:11:11,587
IQ AND THEY UNDERSTAND CERTAIN
THINGS, THEY UNDERSTAND WHAT

202
00:11:11,670 --> 00:11:14,657
THEY'RE USING. BASICALLY
THE FAULT OF INVESTORS IS TYPICALLY

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00:11:14,740 --> 00:11:18,427
I USE IT, THEREFORE IT'S VALUABLE.
YEAH. WHAT AN ENTERPRISE USES. IT'S DOING

204
00:11:18,510 --> 00:11:22,067
COMPLICATED MANUFACTURING
OR PHARMACOLOGICAL RESEARCH OR

205
00:11:22,150 --> 00:11:25,237
PUTTING A BOMB ON OR BRINGING
SPECIAL FORCES PEOPLE HOME

206
00:11:25,320 --> 00:11:27,307
SAFELY. VERY DIFFERENT
THAN WHAT YOU'RE USING.

207
00:11:27,390 --> 00:11:31,277
>> IF YOU'RE A PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANY OR
YOU'RE THE GOVERNMENT, SHOULD YOU NOT BE

208
00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:36,047
THEREFORE USING ANTHROPIC
OR IT'S AN OPEN AI WITHOUT YOUR

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00:11:36,130 --> 00:11:39,617
LAYER ON TOP? I MEAN, IS THAT WOULD
YOU SAY THAT'S DANGEROUS FOR THEM?

210
00:11:39,700 --> 00:11:42,717
>> YOU YOU LOOK, FIRST OF ALL,
HONESTLY, THE ONE THING THAT I

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00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:46,157
AM SLIGHTLY FRUSTRATED ABOUT
THESE THESE WHEN, WHEN, WHEN,

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00:11:46,240 --> 00:11:51,527
WHEN OPENAI OR ANTHROPIC ESPECIALLY ARE
TALKING ABOUT CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE, IT

213
00:11:51,610 --> 00:11:55,397
ONLY IS BEING USED IN OUR PRODUCT,
MY PRODUCT. AND THERE'S A REASON FOR THAT.

214
00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:57,167
THESE THINGS ARE VERY, VERY

215
00:11:57,250 --> 00:12:02,967
VALUABLE. WHAT, WHAT WHAT THEY
HAVE DONE. BUILDING MODELS IS

216
00:12:03,050 --> 00:12:05,647
WORLD HISTORIC. AND JUST SO
YOU SEE, I'M NOT THROWING SHADE.

217
00:12:05,730 --> 00:12:10,247
DARIO IS A LITERALLY HISTORIC
FIGURE. AND HE HE CAME FROM

218
00:12:10,330 --> 00:12:12,417
BEHIND AND HE'S NOW NUMBER ONE.

219
00:12:12,500 --> 00:12:15,417
ALMOST NO ONE IN THE I'VE BEEN
IN BUSINESS. WHATEVER YOU WANT

220
00:12:15,500 --> 00:12:17,417
TO CALL, I DO FOR A LONG TIME.

221
00:12:17,500 --> 00:12:19,687
I'VE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THIS.
OKAY. SO THE REALITY IS

222
00:12:19,770 --> 00:12:22,497
CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE DOES
NOT RUN THESE MODELS WITHOUT AN

223
00:12:22,580 --> 00:12:27,167
APPLICATION LAYER IN ALMOST ALL CASES. AND
MAYBE IT WON'T BE ALL CASES SOMEDAY THAT

224
00:12:27,250 --> 00:12:28,797
APPLICATION LAYERS ARE ONTOLOGY.

225
00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:31,797
THAT'S A FACT. AND THERE'S
A REASON FOR IT. IT'S NOT THAT,

226
00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:34,067
AS YOU KNOW, SOME PEOPLE
LOVE ME, SOME PEOPLE HATE ME.

227
00:12:34,150 --> 00:12:36,907
THEY'RE NOT BUYING.
THEY'RE NOT BUYING IT BECAUSE OF THAT.

228
00:12:36,990 --> 00:12:39,037
THEY'RE BUYING BECAUSE THESE
THINGS HAVE TO BE MADE SAFE.

229
00:12:39,120 --> 00:12:43,817
AND THE I, I'M GOING TO TRUST YOU. YOU
SHOULD TRUST ME BECAUSE I'VE NEVER LIED BS

230
00:12:43,900 --> 00:12:48,787
THING THAT JUST DOESN'T CUT IT AT THIS
LEVEL. AND, AND ENTERPRISES ARE RUN BY THE

231
00:12:48,870 --> 00:12:52,657
SHREWDEST AMERICAN ENTERPRISES
ARE RUN BY THE SHREWDEST, MOST

232
00:12:52,740 --> 00:12:56,087
WILY, INTELLIGENT PEOPLE ON THE PLANET.
IF YOU THINK THEY'RE

233
00:12:56,170 --> 00:12:59,867
GOING FOR THAT, YOU CAN GO TRY
TO SELL ME LIKE MY. MY PARENTS

234
00:12:59,950 --> 00:13:03,097
STILL WANT ME TO GET A JOB
AS A FACULTY MEMBER AT BERKELEY. GO

235
00:13:03,180 --> 00:13:05,097
TRY TO GET ME A JOB AT BERKELEY.

236
00:13:05,180 --> 00:13:06,867
I'M VERY QUALIFIED. IT'S NOT HAPPENING.

237
00:13:06,950 --> 00:13:11,077
>> DO YOU AGREE WITH THE NOTION
OF THE MOST ROBUST, POWERFUL AI

238
00:13:11,160 --> 00:13:14,307
MODELS SHOULD BE WITHHELD FROM THE
PUBLIC DUE TO CYBERSECURITY RISKS.

239
00:13:14,390 --> 00:13:16,917
>> LOOK, FROM. ANTHROPIC AND OPEN AI, YOU.

240
00:13:17,000 --> 00:13:19,717
>> REALLY HAVE TO MAKE THE ONE
OF ONE OF THE THINGS WE'RE

241
00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:22,757
REALLY TRYING TO GET THE WEST
TO DO IS MOVE AWAY FROM LIKE

242
00:13:22,840 --> 00:13:25,657
NOT LIKING IT. THESE ARE VERY
TECHNICAL. WHAT DOES THE MODEL

243
00:13:25,740 --> 00:13:29,797
DO? WHO IS RESTRICTED TO. I WOULD SAY IT
IS A LOSER TO RESTRICT SOMETHING FROM THE

244
00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:32,457
GOVERNMENT, BECAUSE YOU DON'T
AGREE WITH HOW THE GOVERNMENT

245
00:13:32,540 --> 00:13:35,467
FIGHTS WAR AND THEN OPEN IT
UP TO THE WORLD, INCLUDING OUR

246
00:13:35,550 --> 00:13:38,637
ADVERSARIES. GO SELL THAT TO THE AMERICAN
PEOPLE WHERE THEY ALREADY DON'T LIKE YOU.

247
00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:42,567
>> YOU HAVE A LOT OF DATA THAT
YOU LOOK AT. DO YOU THINK CHINA

248
00:13:42,650 --> 00:13:45,337
IS GETTING BETTER AT AI?
HOW IS THE GAP NARROWING?

249
00:13:45,420 --> 00:13:48,747
>> THERE ARE. >> TWO RELEVANT TECH
CENTERS IN TWO AND A HALF AMERICA, CHINA,

250
00:13:48,830 --> 00:13:53,887
ISRAEL. THOSE ARE THE TECH CENTERS OF THE
WORLD. AND WE LIKE I SPENT HALF MY LIFE IN

251
00:13:53,970 --> 00:13:56,917
EUROPE. I WANT EUROPE TO BE RELEVANT.
AND SWEDEN HAS A REAL

252
00:13:57,000 --> 00:13:59,887
TECH SCENE. YOU HAVE TO BE
CAN'T JUST LIKE YOU KNOW. BUT

253
00:13:59,970 --> 00:14:04,557
THE RELEVANT TECH CENTERS WE ARE.
WE HAVE A PEER TO PEER

254
00:14:04,640 --> 00:14:08,197
ADVERSARY IN CHINA. CHINA HAS
LOTS OF ADVANTAGES, INCLUDING.

255
00:14:08,280 --> 00:14:12,907
QUITE FRANKLY, WE HAVE TO FIND
WAYS TO MAKE THESE MODELS RAISE

256
00:14:12,990 --> 00:14:15,467
THE STANDARD OF LIVING
FOR EVERY AMERICA. AND WE NEED A

257
00:14:15,550 --> 00:14:18,477
SENSE AMERICANS NEED TO HAVE A SENSE.
IT'S NOT JUST THE PEOPLE

258
00:14:18,560 --> 00:14:20,707
AT THIS TABLE, PEOPLE WATCHING
IT GETTING RICH, AND THERE ARE

259
00:14:20,790 --> 00:14:22,577
REAL ISSUES THERE. AND WE HAVE.

260
00:14:22,660 --> 00:14:27,587
AND THEN WE HAVE LEFT AND RIGHT, FAR LEFT,
FAR RIGHT, GONE COMPLETELY NUTS. YOU WOULD

261
00:14:27,670 --> 00:14:30,857
THINK THAT THE GREATEST PROBLEM
IN THE WORLD IF YOU WERE ON THE

262
00:14:30,940 --> 00:14:34,457
FAR LEFT IS SOMEHOW IT'S LIKE
IF THINGS WORK, IT'S EVIL AND

263
00:14:34,540 --> 00:14:37,697
BAD. BY THE WAY, I'VE BEEN
WHOLESALE KICKED OUT OF MY OWN

264
00:14:37,780 --> 00:14:40,597
PARTY BECAUSE I WARNED THAT
THIS WAS GOING TO HAPPEN ON THE

265
00:14:40,680 --> 00:14:44,337
LEFT, AND IT IS HAPPENING.
THEN YOU HAVE ON THE FAR RIGHT, LIKE

266
00:14:44,420 --> 00:14:47,467
IT'S LIKE ON BOTH SIDES.
YOU THINK THE BIGGEST PROBLEM OF

267
00:14:47,550 --> 00:14:50,677
OUR SOCIETY ARE LIKE WARLOCKS
ROAMING THE STREET BUILDING

268
00:14:50,760 --> 00:14:52,977
TECHNOLOGY. THEY OF COURSE,
THEY CAN'T UNDERSTAND IT. LIKE

269
00:14:53,060 --> 00:14:55,377
THEY ATTACK PALANTIR FOR THE CRAZIEST.
CHINA DOESN'T HAVE

270
00:14:55,460 --> 00:14:57,477
THAT PROBLEM, BUT IT ALSO

271
00:14:57,560 --> 00:14:59,287
DOESN'T HAVE THE CREATIVITY AND

272
00:14:59,370 --> 00:15:03,657
INGENUITY AND, AND DEEP TECH

273
00:15:03,740 --> 00:15:07,257
CREATIVITY WE HAVE.
BUT THE REALITY IS IT'S NOT A FOREGONE

274
00:15:07,340 --> 00:15:10,897
CONCLUSION THAT WE WIN,
THAT WE HAVE WE HAVE THE BIGGEST

275
00:15:10,980 --> 00:15:14,627
PROBLEM IN THIS COUNTRY ON THESE DEBATES
IS WE DEBATE THESE THINGS AS IF WE DON'T

276
00:15:14,710 --> 00:15:18,497
HAVE ADVERSARIES. IT'S NOT
ACTUALLY TRUE. IT'S BINARY.

277
00:15:18,580 --> 00:15:22,137
THEY WILL WIN OR WE WILL WIN.
>> LET ME ASK YOU, I JUST WANT

278
00:15:22,220 --> 00:15:25,607
TO PIVOT TO A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT
CONVERSATION, BUT RELATED, YOU HAVE BEEN A

279
00:15:25,690 --> 00:15:28,547
PROPONENT AND GREAT SUPPORTER
OF ISRAEL OVER THE YEARS, GREAT

280
00:15:28,630 --> 00:15:32,417
SUPPORTER OF ISRAEL. AND RIGHT
NOW WE HAVE A CEASE FIRE IN THE

281
00:15:32,500 --> 00:15:34,587
MIDDLE EAST, WHICH WE HOPE

282
00:15:34,670 --> 00:15:39,687
HOLDS. HAVING SAID THAT, THERE
IS A BIT OF SPACE BETWEEN WHERE

283
00:15:39,770 --> 00:15:45,057
THE U.S. IS NOW AND WHERE NETANYAHU IS
ON WHAT IS HAPPENING HERE AND WHETHER THEY

284
00:15:45,140 --> 00:15:47,497
ULTIMATELY BE PROTECTED.
AND I'M CURIOUS, GIVEN THAT AND

285
00:15:47,580 --> 00:15:50,097
GIVEN ALSO YOUR RELATIONSHIP
WITH THE U.S. GOVERNMENT AND

286
00:15:50,180 --> 00:15:54,207
THE WORK YOU DO THERE,
HOW YOU THINK ABOUT THAT DISCONNECT?

287
00:15:54,290 --> 00:15:59,007
>> THE THIS IS LIKE SO MANY THINGS.
I AM THE MOST PUBLICLY

288
00:15:59,090 --> 00:16:00,807
SUPPORTIVE CEO OF ISRAEL. AND

289
00:16:00,890 --> 00:16:04,347
THAT'S TRUE. I THINK ISRAEL IS

290
00:16:04,430 --> 00:16:08,187
A IS ON THE SIDE OF GOOD NOW IN

291
00:16:08,270 --> 00:16:12,717
PRIVATE, BECAUSE I HAVE. I'M KNOWN THERE.
TO BE FAIR, I'M PROBABLY ALSO THE MOST

292
00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:15,587
EFFECTIVE CRITIC OF LIKE,
HEY, I DIDN'T AGREE WITH THIS

293
00:16:15,670 --> 00:16:18,657
WITHOUT GOING. AND I WOULD BE
VERY HAPPY TO BE MORE IN PUBLIC

294
00:16:18,740 --> 00:16:21,897
ABOUT THAT. EXCEPT FOR,
I THINK, NOT ALL. THERE ARE MANY

295
00:16:21,980 --> 00:16:24,697
LEGITIMATE CRITICISMS OF ISRAEL
AND EVERY OTHER COUNTRY,

296
00:16:24,780 --> 00:16:28,237
ALTHOUGH I WOULD SAY,
DO YOU WANT A COUNTRY THAT CAN

297
00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:32,407
SOMETIMES BE DIFFICULT AS YOUR PARTNER,
OR DO YOU WANT A COUNTRY, OR DO YOU WANT

298
00:16:32,490 --> 00:16:35,407
PARTNERS THAT HAVE NO TECH
SCENE AS A PARTNER? AND SO LIKE,

299
00:16:35,490 --> 00:16:38,977
IT'S LIKE IN THIS WORLD, HAVING A,
A FULLY ADULT, INDEPENDENT

300
00:16:39,060 --> 00:16:41,947
ALIGNED COUNTRY THAT DOESN'T
ALWAYS AGREE WITH US IS MUCH

301
00:16:42,030 --> 00:16:45,257
BETTER THAN WHAT WE SOMEHOW
HAVE IN EUROPE. LIKE THAT'S WE

302
00:16:45,340 --> 00:16:48,727
DO NOT WANT THAT. YES. OKAY. SO

303
00:16:48,810 --> 00:16:52,357
LOOK, AMERICAN ISRAEL WILL
ALWAYS HAVE WILL NEVER BE FULLY

304
00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:56,297
ALIGNED. AND THAT'S TOTALLY OKAY.
MY POSITION IS THEY ARE A

305
00:16:56,380 --> 00:16:59,407
VERY IMPORTANT PARTNER AND WE
ARE PROUD TO SUPPORT THEM. AND

306
00:16:59,490 --> 00:17:03,537
IN PRIVATE, YOU CAN BET YOUR LAST DOLLAR
I CALL AND COMPLAIN ABOUT A LOT OF THINGS.

307
00:17:03,620 --> 00:17:07,277
>> SO WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THIS
MOU OR WHATEVER DEAL YOU THINK

308
00:17:07,360 --> 00:17:10,647
IS IS ON OFFER AND WHATEVER
THE DEAL THAT IS, DO YOU THINK THAT

309
00:17:10,730 --> 00:17:13,547
WE ARE NOW IN A BETTER
PLACE THAN WE WERE BEFORE?

310
00:17:13,630 --> 00:17:17,717
>> YOU MEAN IN. >> IRAN, IN IRAN, AND,
AND, AND VIS A VIS ALSO WHAT YOU THINK

311
00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:22,357
IT MEANS FOR ISRAEL? >> WELL, LOOK,
I DON'T ISRAEL, I'M GOING TO LEAVE THE I'M

312
00:17:22,440 --> 00:17:25,497
GOING TO LEAVE THE ISRAELI
THING FOR MY TALKING TO THEM IN

313
00:17:25,580 --> 00:17:28,327
PRIVATE, BECAUSE I JUST DON'T
THINK AT THIS POINT IT'S VERY

314
00:17:28,410 --> 00:17:32,237
HARD IN PUBLIC TO TALK ABOUT THEM BECAUSE
YOU JUST HAVE PEOPLE LOOK, THERE ARE

315
00:17:32,320 --> 00:17:33,237
LEGITIMATE CRITICISMS OF ISRAEL.

316
00:17:33,320 --> 00:17:35,307
HALF THE PEOPLE CRITICIZING
ISRAEL JUST DON'T BELIEVE IT

317
00:17:35,390 --> 00:17:38,307
SHOULD EXIST. AND THAT'S JUST
A FACT. AND SO LIKE, I'M NOT

318
00:17:38,390 --> 00:17:41,277
GOING TO LIKE TOTALLY PLAY INTO
THEIR HANDS BY SAYING THINGS I

319
00:17:41,360 --> 00:17:44,877
SAY IN PRIVATE IN AMERICA,
AMERICA HAS TO REP HIS OWN

320
00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:48,517
INTERESTS. DO I THINK IRAN'S
BEEN DEGRADED? YES. ARE THERE

321
00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:51,357
THINGS THAT I DON'T THINK ARE
IN THE PUBLIC SPACE THAT WOULD

322
00:17:51,440 --> 00:17:55,687
BE COMFORTING TO PEOPLE? IF THEY ARE,
YES, AND I'LL LEAVE IT AT THAT.

323
00:17:55,770 --> 00:17:59,027
>> WOW. PRETTY GREAT. >> THANK YOU.

324
00:17:59,110 --> 00:18:02,327
>> THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. TAKE CARE.
HAVE TO GET UP FROM THE SEAT.

325
00:18:02,410 --> 00:18:07,167
>> YOU KNOW, I JUST LIKE I FEEL LIKE
I'M GOING TO BE KICKED OUT OF THE ROOM.

326
00:18:07,250 --> 00:18:10,037
>> NOPE. NEVER WIDE RANGING CONVERSATION.
I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

327
00:18:10,120 --> 00:18:14,347
>> NO, NOT LIKE YOUR PARTY. WE WANT YOU
TO. WE WANT YOU TO STAY. CAN YOU COME BACK

328
00:18:14,430 --> 00:18:17,377
TOMORROW? >> YEAH. NO, I'LL COME BACK.
I REALLY DO APPRECIATE.

329
00:18:17,460 --> 00:18:20,317
>> YOU TALKING. >> TO IT.
>> YEAH. YOU KNOW, THE THING I

330
00:18:20,400 --> 00:18:24,487
ACTUALLY LIKE ABOUT YOU GUYS THE MOST AND
I WATCH YOU IS JUST THAT YOU ACTUALLY. AND

331
00:18:24,570 --> 00:18:26,357
IT'S VERY HARD TO PULL THIS OFF.

332
00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:29,357
YOU ACTUALLY HAVE DIVERGENT OPINIONS,
AND SOMEHOW YOU GUYS STAY TOGETHER.

333
00:18:29,440 --> 00:18:31,397
>> THIS IS TRUE. >> IT'S STILL ON CAMERA.

334
00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:33,397
>> OH, YEAH. >> WELL, GREAT. THAT'S TRUE.

335
00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:36,167
>> YOU ACTUALLY LIKE IT'S
HONESTLY, IT'S SO BORING. THE

336
00:18:36,250 --> 00:18:40,067
OTHER STUFF LIKE. AND AGAIN,
I GET KICKED OUT OF THESE ROOMS.

337
00:18:40,150 --> 00:18:45,377
EVEN IF EVEN IF I AGREED WITH YOU, I WOULD
TRY TO DISAGREE WITH YOU. IT'S MORE FUN.

338
00:18:45,460 --> 00:18:47,947
>> THERE'S SEYMA. THANK YOU
FOR BRINGING ALEX HERE THIS MORNING.

339
00:18:48,030 --> 00:18:50,677
THANK YOU FOR YOUR PERSPECTIVE
ON THIS, ALEX. THANK YOU. WE

340
00:18:50,760 --> 00:18:51,847
APPRECIATE IT VERY, VERY MUCH.

341
00:18:51,930 --> 00:18:53,817
THANKS. >> PEOPLE LIVE IN ECHO CHAMBERS.

342
00:18:53,900 --> 00:18:56,917
>> IT'S IT'S BEEN SO OFFENDED
TO HEAR DIVERGENT OPINION. IT'S LIKE,

343
00:18:57,000 --> 00:19:02,027
>> WHAT DO YOU LIKE? IT'S SO CRAZY.
AND I'LL TELL YOU, WE'RE OFF CAMERA NOW.

344
00:19:02,110 --> 00:19:05,027
>> NO, WE'RE STILL GOING.
>> LET ME GET OFF CAMERA. WHAT,

345
00:19:05,110 --> 00:19:07,897
DO YOU WANT ME TO READ
THIS TRUMP STUFF OR NOT?

346
00:19:07,980 --> 00:19:12,767
>> YOU KNOW? >> OKAY, HOLD ON, ALEX.
I NOW NOW WE'RE STILL ON AND I'M

347
00:19:12,850 --> 00:19:16,367
GOING TO READ THIS BECAUSE PRESIDENT TRUMP
WAS JUST SPEAKING TO REPORTERS AT JOINT

348
00:19:16,450 --> 00:19:19,707
BASE ANDREWS. HE'S PREPARING
TO TAKE HIS FIRST FLIGHT ON THE

349
00:19:19,790 --> 00:19:24,377
QATARI GIFTED AIR FORCE ONE. HE'S EN ROUTE
TO NORTH DAKOTA FOR THE OPENING OF TEDDY

350
00:19:24,460 --> 00:19:28,287
ROOSEVELT'S PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY.
HE ADDRESSED YESTERDAY'S FINANCIAL

351
00:19:28,370 --> 00:19:31,487
DISCLOSURES, SAYING EVERYONE
IS PROFITING, INCLUDING HIM,

352
00:19:31,570 --> 00:19:33,340
BECAUSE THE STOCK MARKET IS UP AND