WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:01.757 Well, we are joined by Alex Karp. 00:00:01.840 --> 00:00:05.517 Welcome to the show. [screaming] Thank you so much for taking the time. Uh you guys 00:00:05.600 --> 00:00:09.477 >> with or without hat? >> Uh whatever's comfortable for you. You can do hat. 00:00:09.560 --> 00:00:12.917 >> out here. >> Is it cold on this cold >> is an average day for you. You're always 00:00:13.000 --> 00:00:14.437 out skiing. You're you're cold. 00:00:14.520 --> 00:00:17.357 >> We should have done the Yeah, we need to get We're close to getting skis. Look. 00:00:17.440 --> 00:00:19.997 >> we could we Well, you know, we are supposed to do something physical. 00:00:20.080 --> 00:00:21.877 >> It's starting to stare. It's starting to stare. 00:00:21.960 --> 00:00:23.877 >> to >> Oh, I like this. But I Now I feel like a 00:00:23.960 --> 00:00:27.237 newscaster. I feel important. Yeah, this is good. 00:00:27.320 --> 00:00:29.917 >> You're like 8 ft tall. >> You don't realize [laughter] that. 00:00:30.000 --> 00:00:32.877 >> Yeah, yeah, yeah. He's not standing up because it would be like he's like 00:00:32.960 --> 00:00:37.077 counteracting for all of us. >> It's like he's like 8 ft. 00:00:37.160 --> 00:00:39.877 >> Last time we talked to you, I think you were doing 4 minutes on the dead hang. 00:00:39.960 --> 00:00:44.197 What's it up to now? >> 5:05 >> 5:05 >> 5:05. What about in the cold, though? 00:00:44.280 --> 00:00:45.277 That's going to affect you, right? 00:00:45.360 --> 00:00:49.797 >> We need to have a special minute for that. 5:05. For those of you who haven't 00:00:49.880 --> 00:00:51.677 done a dead hang, first of all, go do it. 00:00:51.760 --> 00:00:54.997 >> Why is it important? >> Um well, there there are very few things 00:00:55.080 --> 00:00:58.477 that are proxy indicators that are accurate for health. It's like dead 00:00:58.560 --> 00:01:01.997 hang, farmer's walk, body weight, and VO2 are the three ones that count. 00:01:02.080 --> 00:01:05.637 >> Okay. >> I don't think anyone really >> one rep max bench bench press? That's 00:01:05.720 --> 00:01:07.957 all I focus on. >> Okay, well, you know, it's like 00:01:08.040 --> 00:01:10.837 >> I feel like I feel like as long as I have a really impressive bench press, 00:01:10.920 --> 00:01:13.597 I'll I'll live a short but glorious life. 00:01:13.680 --> 00:01:15.117 >> Yeah, I don't know. >> Didn't they say something like that? 00:01:15.200 --> 00:01:17.677 Yeah, they >> Who wants to live a long glorious life 00:01:17.760 --> 00:01:19.837 when you can live a glorious short life? 00:01:19.920 --> 00:01:23.637 >> Yeah, I think that's what they tell you before they give you a bad salary and 00:01:23.720 --> 00:01:26.837 something like that. >> [laughter] >> I think I think it's like yeah, it's or 00:01:26.920 --> 00:01:30.637 it's like yeah, my social life is so great I only have a bot, but I enjoy it. 00:01:30.720 --> 00:01:34.837 >> Yeah, so >> A kind of logic. No, but No, it's um >> Dead hang's important. 00:01:34.920 --> 00:01:39.077 >> Dead hang is crucial. And you really need to go work on it. Especially anyone 00:01:39.160 --> 00:01:43.157 watching your podcast >> Yes. >> is likely to outperform. 00:01:43.240 --> 00:01:45.597 >> Yeah. >> You want to have some You know, you want 00:01:45.680 --> 00:01:48.117 to be able to do something with that outperformance. 00:01:48.200 --> 00:01:50.317 >> Yeah, like dead hang. >> Like Yeah, well, the dead hang may be a 00:01:50.400 --> 00:01:54.037 proxy indicator for other things you could do with your outperformance, you know. 00:01:54.120 --> 00:01:56.717 >> And you know, >> Not everyone is Yeah, not everyone is 00:01:56.800 --> 00:02:01.197 like 6 ft 9 and like You may not need a dead hang, but the rest of us 00:02:01.280 --> 00:02:05.357 >> Well, I can cheat because most of the pull-up bars I just stand on the floor. 00:02:05.440 --> 00:02:07.037 >> that's right. Yeah. >> And I can hold forever because 00:02:07.120 --> 00:02:08.997 >> forever. Yeah, that's right. That's right. 00:02:09.080 --> 00:02:12.317 >> Um but it But when you're not dead hanging, uh what should people be doing 00:02:12.400 --> 00:02:15.757 with uh the new coding agents? How important is it to learn to code? How 00:02:15.840 --> 00:02:19.197 important is it to >> Look, there there are two Everybody's 00:02:19.280 --> 00:02:22.877 worried about like their future, but there are basically two ways to know you 00:02:22.960 --> 00:02:25.797 have a future. One, you have some vocational training. 00:02:25.880 --> 00:02:29.837 >> Okay. >> So, it's like or two, you're neurodivergent and And I And when I say 00:02:29.920 --> 00:02:31.997 neurodivergent, I mean broadly defined. 00:02:32.080 --> 00:02:35.757 Like You guys are sitting here. You could have had a corporate tool job. 00:02:35.840 --> 00:02:37.397 >> Yeah. >> You could have been like I don't want to 00:02:37.480 --> 00:02:40.597 pick on Goldman, but like just say, you know, like a job 00:02:40.680 --> 00:02:41.517 >> know why they're they're laying me off. 00:02:41.600 --> 00:02:43.237 >> Well, yeah. >> I I I I I I I did work at Goldman Sachs. 00:02:43.320 --> 00:02:45.557 >> Whatever. >> [laughter] >> You could have had You could have had a 00:02:45.640 --> 00:02:48.117 job where you're like a coder. 00:02:48.200 --> 00:02:51.237 It's like yeah, no, actually maybe they didn't know the right way to test. 00:02:51.320 --> 00:02:54.397 >> Yeah. >> Like it's like yeah, they were like like, you know, and whatever. I'm not 00:02:54.480 --> 00:02:59.197 picking on one or the other. I'm just saying you you you know, the like 00:02:59.280 --> 00:03:02.037 you were probably here. You think you're here because of the da da da, but it's 00:03:02.120 --> 00:03:04.597 actually you probably wouldn't have been able to do that cuz there's like 00:03:04.680 --> 00:03:07.797 It's the same thing as Sit down in class and learn some >> Mhm. 00:03:07.880 --> 00:03:09.517 >> Like and you just regurgitate it. 00:03:09.600 --> 00:03:09.797 >> Mhm. 00:03:09.880 --> 00:03:13.997 >> Like that's not a valuable thing. If you 00:03:14.080 --> 00:03:18.917 are actually have insights into anything and you have real technical expertise, 00:03:19.000 --> 00:03:21.717 like you know, you can look at a company, but you actually can look at it 00:03:21.800 --> 00:03:24.197 because you know something about how these things work or something about how 00:03:24.280 --> 00:03:28.997 clients work. You know, then all the other stuff that used to be precious, 00:03:29.080 --> 00:03:33.517 like being able to do low-end coding, being able to do low-end lowering, being 00:03:33.600 --> 00:03:35.117 able to do low-end reading and writing. 00:03:35.200 --> 00:03:38.957 I mean, you got This is like I feel like Odin came down and was like, "I'm going 00:03:39.040 --> 00:03:41.967 to make the world just right for a dyslexic." 00:03:42.050 --> 00:03:45.077 >> [laughter] >> It's like Yeah, I Odin has come down 00:03:45.160 --> 00:03:48.037 from or Loki has come down and said, "You know what, Carp? You suffered so 00:03:48.120 --> 00:03:51.157 much as a kid. I'm just going to make the whole world so everyone else can 00:03:51.240 --> 00:03:55.357 suffer. I don't want that. It's like now, but it's really an inversion. Like 00:03:55.440 --> 00:03:59.597 everybody with like the normal shaped skulls are dyslexics cuz like the 00:03:59.680 --> 00:04:03.797 meaning the thing they can do that used to be valuable is not so valuable. The 00:04:03.880 --> 00:04:07.517 thing that they need to learn to do is like be more of an artist, look at 00:04:07.600 --> 00:04:10.917 things from a different direction, be able to build something unique. 00:04:11.000 --> 00:04:14.517 >> Mhm. >> And then you see this on the battlefield like and one of the most 00:04:14.600 --> 00:04:18.437 underappreciated things about fighting a war, which is the I mean there are basic 00:04:18.520 --> 00:04:20.677 core things civilizations do. Like build 00:04:20.760 --> 00:04:23.917 technology for war. Is every society 00:04:24.000 --> 00:04:28.077 fights differently. Every component of this society fights differently. And 00:04:28.160 --> 00:04:31.957 when like American as allies that we do not even approach these problems in the 00:04:32.040 --> 00:04:36.837 same way. What it makes America lethal it more so than any currently country is 00:04:36.920 --> 00:04:40.437 like a combination of obviously the technology, which we're super interested 00:04:40.520 --> 00:04:45.717 in and and and believe are paying a huge part in. Um but it's like 20 years of 00:04:45.800 --> 00:04:49.317 like operators figuring out what worked, what 00:04:49.400 --> 00:04:54.157 not what worked in a manual. Like what worked in reality. Also, even selection. 00:04:54.240 --> 00:04:58.197 If you look at the selection of people like you meet like tier one operators 00:04:58.280 --> 00:05:00.637 they don't look anything like what people would think. It's not like the 00:05:00.720 --> 00:05:04.517 movies. They're like these like these like this big and like you know, it's 00:05:04.600 --> 00:05:07.317 like because we have Yeah, we have we have we have 00:05:07.400 --> 00:05:10.197 specialized ways of doing that. All that 00:05:10.280 --> 00:05:14.757 is crazy valuable. A- as a proxy indicator people who are 00:05:14.840 --> 00:05:19.517 getting their news from you are just likely to massively outperform people 00:05:19.600 --> 00:05:22.237 are getting their news from something that's a regurgitation of you got to 00:05:22.320 --> 00:05:25.237 vote for one party or the other. Um 00:05:25.320 --> 00:05:29.317 and then the the real problem we have in society is not your listeners or 00:05:29.400 --> 00:05:31.877 Palantir's customers or our partners. 00:05:31.960 --> 00:05:35.277 It's like well, what happens to everyone else? Are they going to lynch us? Cuz 00:05:35.360 --> 00:05:37.197 like that's the real problem. Like these 00:05:37.280 --> 00:05:39.477 products like what we're building like 00:05:39.560 --> 00:05:42.477 our our our our agents mean that like 00:05:42.560 --> 00:05:46.517 the most I mean the most powerful people in the Democratic Party are highly 00:05:46.600 --> 00:05:51.357 educated female voters. And these technologies, like they love they I mean 00:05:51.440 --> 00:05:54.037 like yeah, I actually get along with all these people in private and this is a 00:05:54.120 --> 00:05:56.797 public dispute, but like largely I've talked to Daria over and over and it's 00:05:56.880 --> 00:06:00.317 like, "Yeah, you love one company cuz they they're not pro-Trump. That 00:06:00.400 --> 00:06:02.317 company's taking your job." >> Mhm. 00:06:02.400 --> 00:06:04.837 >> How are you going to feel about that company when you find that you have no 00:06:04.920 --> 00:06:07.877 job? >> Mhm. >> And how what what What do you think the 00:06:07.960 --> 00:06:11.117 Republican Party's going to do to products that do not support our 00:06:11.200 --> 00:06:13.677 military? What do you think the Democratic Party's going to do to 00:06:13.760 --> 00:06:16.837 products, even if you're voting for them, that are taking away the jobs of 00:06:16.920 --> 00:06:19.357 every one of your constituents and saying, "Oh, people are going to love 00:06:19.440 --> 00:06:20.797 you so much and you're going to be poor." 00:06:20.880 --> 00:06:22.557 >> Mhm. >> By the way, we love you so much we're 00:06:22.640 --> 00:06:25.117 going to give you a little handout once a month. 00:06:25.200 --> 00:06:27.717 >> Yeah. >> Like yeah. >> So apply that to the the the 00:06:27.800 --> 00:06:29.677 SaaS-pocalypse narrative. The enterprise 00:06:29.760 --> 00:06:32.117 SaaS, there's an idea that uh the first 00:06:32.200 --> 00:06:34.877 jobs that will be taken might be the 00:06:34.960 --> 00:06:39.517 enterprise software products that exist, haven't really innovated, have lock-in, 00:06:39.600 --> 00:06:40.917 and they're going to be re-platformed. 00:06:41.000 --> 00:06:45.917 >> Uh if you the the the thing that these technologies do is they also make it 00:06:46.000 --> 00:06:49.197 harder to lie about This is what part of the political realm 00:06:49.280 --> 00:06:52.317 If something's not creating value or something's not working or there's 00:06:52.400 --> 00:06:55.637 corruption, you can't lie about it. And 00:06:55.720 --> 00:06:58.597 nobody believes that all software 00:06:58.680 --> 00:07:03.317 companies actually create value. I mean, the famous thing that we all learned was 00:07:03.400 --> 00:07:06.677 what that we rejected that you were learned and people taught you is like, 00:07:06.760 --> 00:07:10.797 "Your software company is supposed to give the client the feeling they're 00:07:10.880 --> 00:07:12.477 getting laid while they're getting fucked." 00:07:12.560 --> 00:07:16.557 >> Yeah. >> Now, if that's how your products actually are, 00:07:16.640 --> 00:07:19.717 you argue Now, it's you who are going to get Like and this is going to 00:07:19.800 --> 00:07:22.277 happen so quickly. And the simple test 00:07:22.360 --> 00:07:27.117 for people who are looking at this is does this product or in our case, we 00:07:27.200 --> 00:07:29.077 were never pure software. We're actually 00:07:29.160 --> 00:07:32.677 like a hybrid of like humans, FTEs, 00:07:32.760 --> 00:07:35.517 augmented humans, so AI FTEs, and then 00:07:35.600 --> 00:07:39.757 orchestration, and then and essentially what we would call primitives, like 00:07:39.840 --> 00:07:43.077 taking the tribal knowledge of institution, coding it into logic, and 00:07:43.160 --> 00:07:45.597 then using that to be extended in LLMs. 00:07:45.680 --> 00:07:48.437 Okay. But we don't have to explain that to our clients. 00:07:48.520 --> 00:07:51.157 >> Yeah. >> You know. >> So so so there's there was always this 00:07:51.240 --> 00:07:54.717 always Palantir consulting firm. Is it all just people? Is there any real 00:07:54.800 --> 00:07:57.397 software? I feel like that narrative went away. 00:07:57.480 --> 00:08:00.797 >> Oh, no no. They they they couldn't invest in us cuz we were a services 00:08:00.880 --> 00:08:03.197 >> Yeah, exactly. >> And now now it's like and now 00:08:03.280 --> 00:08:07.357 >> But but but is is is actually having that service capability better in the 00:08:07.440 --> 00:08:10.357 future? >> it's not better. It's >> crucial. It's cru 00:08:10.440 --> 00:08:13.997 >> It's crucial. Like all these places that made fun of us >> Yes. 00:08:14.080 --> 00:08:15.677 >> they're running around and trying to get 00:08:15.760 --> 00:08:20.357 FTEs. Getting an FTE is like yeah, it's like yeah, it's not as easy as it sounds 00:08:20.440 --> 00:08:23.397 cuz you have to know how to manage it, where to put the person, how to extract 00:08:23.480 --> 00:08:27.757 value. And then you need all these products that augment the FTE. All 00:08:27.840 --> 00:08:28.837 right, what are those products? 00:08:28.920 --> 00:08:33.717 Ontology, Foundry, FTE things that we've built. 00:08:33.800 --> 00:08:37.077 >> Yeah. >> What we the being able to >> the value of the business is not a 00:08:37.160 --> 00:08:38.997 monolithic code base that never changes. 00:08:39.080 --> 00:08:41.077 It is the people. It is the deployment. 00:08:41.160 --> 00:08:43.677 It is the relationships. Is that how you're thinking about the business these 00:08:43.760 --> 00:08:47.557 days? >> Well, actually, the way I I'm telling you like when you walk around here 00:08:47.640 --> 00:08:50.197 >> Yeah. >> they only care they don't care about any of that. 00:08:50.280 --> 00:08:52.157 >> Yeah. >> What they care about is you transform my 00:08:52.240 --> 00:08:55.717 business in in 3 months. It would have taken 3 years and I would never have 00:08:55.800 --> 00:08:57.997 happened. >> Yeah. >> That's what they care about. Now then 00:08:58.080 --> 00:08:59.397 there's a question of how do you do 00:08:59.480 --> 00:09:02.597 that? And that is a that is a concatena- 00:09:02.680 --> 00:09:05.357 It's artistry. It's like select client, 00:09:05.440 --> 00:09:10.037 select where you would start, select ways in which you innovate in ways they 00:09:10.120 --> 00:09:14.157 would not accept, innovate in places they do not understand. You should innovate. 00:09:14.240 --> 00:09:17.717 Learn to manage these very complex By the way, it's not just culturally 00:09:17.800 --> 00:09:20.917 complex. It's tribal knowledge. And much 00:09:21.000 --> 00:09:25.077 of that tribal knowledge is in rules that they have to apply because there 00:09:25.160 --> 00:09:29.117 all sorts of rules about manufacturing, hospitals, war, 00:09:29.200 --> 00:09:30.757 rules that are applied that they're not 00:09:30.840 --> 00:09:34.037 saying they apply, laws, like all sorts 00:09:34.120 --> 00:09:36.597 of regulat- regulatory things on top of 00:09:36.680 --> 00:09:41.437 all that. All that has to happen very rapidly. So, you would need and like 00:09:41.520 --> 00:09:44.637 without going into details like I'm in the middle of like every single one of 00:09:44.720 --> 00:09:48.317 these discussions in almost every breakdown it's like people do not 00:09:48.400 --> 00:09:51.277 understand how institutions work. They don't understand how the software would 00:09:51.360 --> 00:09:54.197 work. They don't know how the LM would work. They don't know how the product 00:09:54.280 --> 00:09:57.797 that would actually work in that environment and they still at the end of 00:09:57.880 --> 00:10:00.157 the day are not saying we're going to charge on value. 00:10:00.240 --> 00:10:02.237 >> Okay, how do you institutions work? Why 00:10:02.320 --> 00:10:07.757 is it that we get these genius models that are 160 IQ? They can solve 00:10:07.840 --> 00:10:11.277 incredible math and they're not just like everywhere all of the time. What is 00:10:11.360 --> 00:10:14.157 slowing down adoption? >> mean the simple version is they're 160 00:10:14.240 --> 00:10:16.917 against a test. But the test isn't it's 00:10:17.000 --> 00:10:18.717 a concatenation. The simple math would 00:10:18.800 --> 00:10:21.877 be it's 160 on one test but you've got 00:10:21.960 --> 00:10:26.437 to pass differentiated tests over a long period of time. So, it's a thousand tests. 00:10:26.520 --> 00:10:29.397 >> Yeah. >> So, de facto by the 50th step it's zero 00:10:29.480 --> 00:10:31.917 IQ. But then there's also there's also 00:10:32.000 --> 00:10:36.717 yeah, I mean it's like it's it's it's insane. Like no I love when I hear about 00:10:36.800 --> 00:10:39.317 all this is going to replace and then I go to our clients and they're like could 00:10:39.400 --> 00:10:43.237 we have more? We don't even have the capacity. Like it's like it's a surreal 00:10:43.320 --> 00:10:47.157 thing. Like would you guys like [laughter] to be FTEs cuz we need some help. 00:10:47.240 --> 00:10:51.677 If you're in the audience completely seriously and you're aligned broadly 00:10:51.760 --> 00:10:54.597 speaking with America is a great country. You don't have to agree about 00:10:54.680 --> 00:10:59.197 anything else and you're out there and you're technical or just smart. Apply. 00:10:59.280 --> 00:11:01.517 We need you. >> Okay, America is a great country. Put 00:11:01.600 --> 00:11:05.317 aside Democrat. Put aside Republican. Is 00:11:05.400 --> 00:11:08.237 democracy the correct formulation to 00:11:08.320 --> 00:11:11.037 decide the future of AI? Should the 00:11:11.120 --> 00:11:14.197 American people be voting or should that 00:11:14.280 --> 00:11:15.877 be handled by private companies? 00:11:15.960 --> 00:11:18.517 >> No, America well, it depends. Like 00:11:18.600 --> 00:11:20.797 like yeah, great. So, in the war 00:11:20.880 --> 00:11:25.677 fighting context the Department of War has to be the 00:11:25.760 --> 00:11:27.797 arbiter of what gets deployed. 00:11:27.880 --> 00:11:30.277 >> As a citizen I vote for the Department of War, right? 00:11:30.360 --> 00:11:34.677 >> Exactly, yeah. Now, okay but but I'm just saying. So, I I want to split >> Yes. 00:11:34.760 --> 00:11:39.117 >> and and foreign. >> Okay. >> We in this country have God-given 00:11:39.200 --> 00:11:41.797 rights, literally given to us by higher being. There's a right of free 00:11:41.880 --> 00:11:44.957 expression, which >> Mhm. >> we're exercising all the time, and is a 00:11:45.040 --> 00:11:47.997 very important to us. >> Mhm. >> There's a Second Amendment, which I 00:11:48.080 --> 00:11:50.517 exercise. I I shoot very well. 00:11:50.600 --> 00:11:53.757 >> Yeah. >> I would encourage you guys and other people that are listening to avail 00:11:53.840 --> 00:11:55.197 yourself of the Second Amendment. 00:11:55.280 --> 00:11:58.317 >> Yes. >> Uh it was not It is there to protect 00:11:58.400 --> 00:12:00.117 ourselves in case the First Amendment fails. 00:12:00.200 --> 00:12:02.437 >> Mhm. >> That's the reason it's there. There's a 00:12:02.520 --> 00:12:07.277 a Fourth Amendment, which is essentially we have a right to privacy. Okay. 00:12:07.360 --> 00:12:09.237 >> We have those rights. >> Mhm. 00:12:09.320 --> 00:12:12.597 >> Adversaries trying to kill us in Iran do not have those rights. 00:12:12.680 --> 00:12:15.197 >> Sure. >> And I don't believe I've never believed 00:12:15.280 --> 00:12:19.117 in extending our rights to foreign countries that are adversarial to us. 00:12:19.200 --> 00:12:23.317 >> Mhm. >> I don't even really believe I don't like, you know, in Germany, >> Mhm. 00:12:23.400 --> 00:12:25.797 >> where I lived half my life, they don't have a First Amendment. 00:12:25.880 --> 00:12:28.477 >> Mhm. >> They don't believe it. And by the way, they've never believed in a First 00:12:28.560 --> 00:12:29.557 Amendment. They have other rights. 00:12:29.640 --> 00:12:32.797 >> That's great. >> I'm not going to dispute that, but I want our rights here. 00:12:32.880 --> 00:12:35.277 >> Mhm. >> In this country, 00:12:35.360 --> 00:12:40.517 uh if you're going to tell the American people you're building what is clearly a 00:12:40.600 --> 00:12:44.317 dangerous technology. It's dangerous because it it will likely take your job, 00:12:44.400 --> 00:12:46.637 >> Mhm. >> it especially if you're white-collar. 00:12:46.720 --> 00:12:49.997 So, >> Mhm. >> if you're voting, you know, you're highly educated 00:12:50.080 --> 00:12:54.787 >> Have you flipped on that in the last like 6 months or so because I think 00:12:54.870 --> 00:12:56.997 >> [clears throat] >> I think the last time we talked, your 00:12:57.080 --> 00:13:01.237 general mindset was like high agency 00:13:01.320 --> 00:13:05.077 highly productive people will be able to continue to leverage the tools to 00:13:05.160 --> 00:13:07.157 deliver value within organizations. 00:13:07.240 --> 00:13:10.637 >> Yeah, I think if you're neurodivergent and high agency and you're highly 00:13:10.720 --> 00:13:14.557 educated, that's great. But, if you're not neurodivergent and you're like 00:13:14.640 --> 00:13:17.557 lawyer 14506, that's a problem. 00:13:17.640 --> 00:13:19.637 >> Mhm. >> Okay. But, let me get to this and 00:13:19.720 --> 00:13:21.877 they're they're linked, but it's okay. 00:13:21.960 --> 00:13:25.317 On domestic stuff, uh 00:13:25.400 --> 00:13:29.117 I we have rights that are not 00:13:29.200 --> 00:13:31.997 subject to majority rule. Like I the 00:13:32.080 --> 00:13:36.557 majority can vote against us having Fourth Amendment rights. I want that I 00:13:36.640 --> 00:13:41.037 want that litigated at the Supreme Court because I we are not our Constitution is 00:13:41.120 --> 00:13:44.197 not about majority rights. Actually about the rights of the minority and 00:13:44.280 --> 00:13:47.517 it's our right all I bet you the three of us have opinions that are very much 00:13:47.600 --> 00:13:51.397 in the minority that we want to be able to say at least in the privacy of our 00:13:51.480 --> 00:13:56.037 own home, right? And so so that there are real issues. I'm super sympathetic 00:13:56.120 --> 00:13:59.317 with restrictions around the use of these 00:13:59.400 --> 00:14:03.357 products in a domestic context even though it's funny people out there every 00:14:03.440 --> 00:14:06.837 conspiracy theorist thinks yeah, it's insane. I'm the only one 00:14:06.920 --> 00:14:10.397 conspiracy theorist you may hate this but there's one person protecting your 00:14:10.480 --> 00:14:13.597 rights to be a conspiracy theorist that actually has a seat at the table and 00:14:13.680 --> 00:14:16.797 that person is me. You may not you may not want to hear 00:14:16.880 --> 00:14:21.357 that truth but it's it is true and maybe do a little more reading 00:14:21.440 --> 00:14:23.757 before you pontificate on your absurd 00:14:23.840 --> 00:14:28.597 and obviously ill-informed and many times stupid opinions. Okay, so cuz like 00:14:28.680 --> 00:14:29.997 you're attacking the person who's 00:14:30.080 --> 00:14:32.517 protecting you idiot. 00:14:32.600 --> 00:14:35.797 It's like so stupid. Do do use 00:14:35.880 --> 00:14:38.477 one of the bots to correct your opinion. 00:14:38.560 --> 00:14:40.637 It's like I'm being attacked online now. 00:14:40.720 --> 00:14:44.117 It's like Dr. Karp is anti progressive first of all because of my whole life. 00:14:44.200 --> 00:14:46.277 I'm the only one just telling you the truth. These things are going to take 00:14:46.360 --> 00:14:50.957 your job. Okay, so then but in the war fighting context 00:14:51.040 --> 00:14:54.317 and it's the primary justification for these products has to be it's it's 00:14:54.400 --> 00:14:57.477 they're two relevant powers now us and China. 00:14:57.560 --> 00:15:02.157 This is a have have not world. It's going to be either us or them it's 00:15:02.240 --> 00:15:05.837 basically deciding the world order because like these other countries and 00:15:05.920 --> 00:15:09.837 maybe India will will will get involved maybe the Arab non-Arab Middle East but 00:15:09.920 --> 00:15:13.397 currently on the trajectory we're on now there are two places where these things 00:15:13.480 --> 00:15:17.197 are being developed and deployed it's us or them and I'm not particularly you 00:15:17.280 --> 00:15:18.837 know, I'm not I'm not out to hurt China. 00:15:18.920 --> 00:15:20.517 I'm just out to I think we we win. 00:15:20.600 --> 00:15:22.917 >> Yeah. I'm not trying to hurt them. And 00:15:23.000 --> 00:15:27.797 in that context, you can't say we're not going to do X, Y, and Z. 00:15:27.880 --> 00:15:30.077 I mean, I can give you examples, but like >> Sure. 00:15:30.160 --> 00:15:34.317 >> there are data sets that are publicly available in the US market 00:15:34.400 --> 00:15:38.517 that should I don't think should be used against you and me in a law for law 00:15:38.600 --> 00:15:43.197 enforcement context more than with the help of say AI agents and ontology. 00:15:43.280 --> 00:15:47.557 >> Yeah. >> But if you don't use it on the battlefield, you obviously Iran's going 00:15:47.640 --> 00:15:51.157 to use them. You don't think they can go online and buy those products? And And 00:15:51.240 --> 00:15:54.397 by the way, without going into somewhat classified data, those things are in 00:15:54.480 --> 00:15:56.717 combination with other things lethal. 00:15:56.800 --> 00:16:00.917 Like a lot of people who want to hurt America on the battlefield end up dead 00:16:01.000 --> 00:16:04.237 because of our ability to aggregate and then figure out what's going on in the 00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:06.757 battlefield before they can figure out what we're doing. 00:16:06.840 --> 00:16:10.677 And so like I'm very much in favor of it for moral reasons, but I'm also in favor 00:16:10.760 --> 00:16:12.997 of it like I don't know how else you explain this to the American people. 00:16:13.080 --> 00:16:14.957 We're We're going to take your job. 00:16:15.040 --> 00:16:18.517 We're going to take away your going to eviscerate your ability to to to have 00:16:18.600 --> 00:16:21.677 money and power. But that we're not going to defend you on the battlefield 00:16:21.760 --> 00:16:24.357 just seems like yeah, well, they're going to You know what's actually going 00:16:24.440 --> 00:16:27.677 to happen? That nobody believes me in tech, but 00:16:27.760 --> 00:16:30.557 there's going to be a movement in this country that becomes very strong very 00:16:30.640 --> 00:16:32.117 quickly to nationalize these things. 00:16:32.200 --> 00:16:35.397 First, it's going to be take away all our money the bill the billionaires that 00:16:35.480 --> 00:16:36.917 are evil. You may not have heard that. 00:16:37.000 --> 00:16:40.237 Super evil. And if you take away their money, it'll help poor people. That's 00:16:40.320 --> 00:16:43.957 really important to understand. Making rich people miserable is the only way to 00:16:44.040 --> 00:16:45.997 help poor people. That's obviously true. 00:16:46.080 --> 00:16:49.157 So once you've learned that, the next thing you're going to learn is we have 00:16:49.240 --> 00:16:51.957 to nationalize the >> They're going to They're going to quote you on that. 00:16:52.040 --> 00:16:55.517 >> Yeah. Well, >> [laughter] >> it's like >> They've quoted you on on Well, so so I 00:16:55.600 --> 00:16:58.757 mean, it sounds like you're you're you're closer to Dario on, you know, 00:16:58.840 --> 00:17:03.157 potentially 50% of early stage white-collar job loss. Like you're 00:17:03.240 --> 00:17:06.797 you're you're aware that there's a risk at least a probability. You're aware of 00:17:06.880 --> 00:17:10.277 it. Well, what do you see as the solution? 00:17:10.360 --> 00:17:14.317 >> Um well, first we just have to I mean, well, I mean, the obvious thing is okay, 00:17:14.400 --> 00:17:18.157 we can't have any migration here. Like how are we going to more jobs? Like, 00:17:18.240 --> 00:17:22.237 it's like you have to What the problem in fairness not that people want to be 00:17:22.320 --> 00:17:25.357 in the business of being fair to policy leaders, but 00:17:25.440 --> 00:17:29.237 that we are dealing with technologies that will determine the policy 00:17:29.320 --> 00:17:31.237 decisions. So, you can't just pretend 00:17:31.320 --> 00:17:33.237 they're not happening. Like, step one is 00:17:33.320 --> 00:17:36.437 like the we it's going to be hard and 00:17:36.520 --> 00:17:41.117 but possible to make this society work given that 00:17:41.200 --> 00:17:44.397 transforming it requires these technologies. Like, all the like I 00:17:44.480 --> 00:17:45.637 really like the people who are here. 00:17:45.720 --> 00:17:47.677 They're not here cuz they like me. 00:17:47.760 --> 00:17:49.637 Like, maybe they're here for my jokes. 00:17:49.720 --> 00:17:53.277 High quality in some cases. But, it's like a long trip and we're here and then 00:17:53.360 --> 00:17:54.597 I'm the only one who likes this weather. 00:17:54.680 --> 00:17:58.157 It's great weather. I brought it for you. It's >> [laughter] >> but 00:17:58.240 --> 00:18:02.117 they're here because they've seen their business being transformed. And this is 00:18:02.200 --> 00:18:05.877 happening in America more than it. So, we have to win those battles, but the 00:18:05.960 --> 00:18:10.277 costs are going to be very high. And so, you have to work back from Okay, the 00:18:10.360 --> 00:18:14.957 costs are going to be very high. We we can't put oil on the fire. It's like, 00:18:15.040 --> 00:18:18.717 you know, it's like, well, getting jobs for all Americans is going to be hard 00:18:18.800 --> 00:18:22.317 and people maybe who become Americans, but it's like you have to have different 00:18:22.400 --> 00:18:25.477 policies around migration. You have to different policies around how we train 00:18:25.560 --> 00:18:29.557 people. Like, currently, if you're a young kid in high school and you're 00:18:29.640 --> 00:18:33.277 neurodivergent, they're literally track chaining into your chair and feeding you 00:18:33.360 --> 00:18:36.277 medication so you can have skills that are not valuable. 00:18:36.360 --> 00:18:40.317 Like, it's so it's like and then we'll probably over time have to have like a 00:18:40.400 --> 00:18:44.317 discussion of like, yeah, if you go into this career 00:18:44.400 --> 00:18:48.117 you're not going to have a job. Like, a really honest discussion about that. 00:18:48.200 --> 00:18:51.357 These are the places where you are likely have a job. 00:18:51.440 --> 00:18:54.517 And yeah. >> Help me you know, 00:18:54.600 --> 00:18:57.037 it seems like we 00:18:57.120 --> 00:19:00.077 as a country will probably head down a 00:19:00.160 --> 00:19:03.597 more European path where it is becomes 00:19:03.680 --> 00:19:07.357 very very difficult or near impossible to let people go. Do you think that's 00:19:07.440 --> 00:19:12.757 correct? I mean, in Germany, in Germany, it's much harder to to lay someone off. 00:19:12.840 --> 00:19:18.517 And and that does impact I mean that does impact the the growth of of companies. 00:19:18.600 --> 00:19:22.157 >> Mhm. >> But I think many Germans would argue that's probably 00:19:22.240 --> 00:19:25.157 >> Yeah, you know, Germany's I mean I won't I'll I'll answer your question. 00:19:25.240 --> 00:19:29.637 Germany's an interesting place. I did this thing in German where I basically told the 00:19:29.720 --> 00:19:32.957 truth which you're not allowed to do in German. It was like 00:19:33.040 --> 00:19:36.557 you know, it's kind of really bad situation and the economy sucks. The 00:19:36.640 --> 00:19:41.197 migration thing's a complete disaster and the energy situation is like 00:19:41.280 --> 00:19:45.197 compounds everything and I got thousands of people literally 00:19:45.280 --> 00:19:47.677 saying thank god someone told the truth. 00:19:47.760 --> 00:19:52.277 Um and there are a lot of people like you guys, young people building things 00:19:52.360 --> 00:19:55.917 that feel hampered and and and are correct to feel hampered. 00:19:56.000 --> 00:19:59.077 I I think the American version if we're not careful is not going to be the 00:19:59.160 --> 00:20:01.997 German version. I think it's going to be hang the rich. 00:20:02.080 --> 00:20:05.557 I I it's like I think it's going to be not protect everybody else. It's going 00:20:05.640 --> 00:20:08.277 to be like, "Oh look, this is too dangerous and we're going to hang the 00:20:08.360 --> 00:20:12.517 rich but not really help the poor." And this in fairness to the German version, 00:20:12.600 --> 00:20:16.557 like, you know, German like health insurance insurance all that stuff it 00:20:16.640 --> 00:20:21.197 works. Like I was I was poor in Germany for like a decade. And like I had I had 00:20:21.280 --> 00:20:25.157 the best life on the planet. Like it was like being poor in Germany is like being 00:20:25.240 --> 00:20:27.637 better than being rich here in some in some days. 00:20:27.720 --> 00:20:31.877 >> So basically policies that lift the floor, re-education, training. 00:20:31.960 --> 00:20:36.197 >> you're So if you want to do what we could do here, we the things we could 00:20:36.280 --> 00:20:39.197 adopt from Germany are Germany has three high schools. 00:20:39.280 --> 00:20:40.317 >> Yeah. >> Two are vocational. 00:20:40.400 --> 00:20:42.877 >> Sure. >> One is academic. >> Better education. 00:20:42.960 --> 00:20:45.437 >> Better programmatic vocational a 00:20:45.520 --> 00:20:50.197 vocational it also has a bad like a weird vibe here. Like vocational 00:20:50.280 --> 00:20:52.277 training in Germany is very technical. 00:20:52.360 --> 00:20:56.797 Like the people building the cars at BMW or even in the French version Airbus, 00:20:56.880 --> 00:21:00.757 like very complicated jobs. They didn't go to college. They went to a very very 00:21:00.840 --> 00:21:04.197 high-end high school and they come out without any debt. And that stuff is 00:21:04.280 --> 00:21:08.077 really valuable. So if you want to you you have to completely transform our 00:21:08.160 --> 00:21:12.717 educational system and and go very young into like training people to do things. 00:21:12.800 --> 00:21:16.277 You also need to change our testing system. Like different forms of 00:21:16.360 --> 00:21:19.357 intelligence are all of our tests are built around things that are were 00:21:19.440 --> 00:21:21.157 valuable in the Industrial Revolution. 00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:24.397 It's like you want to pull out all the dyslexics, all the neurodivergents, 00:21:24.480 --> 00:21:28.157 everybody who can't sit or needs to build or wants to build have to go into 00:21:28.240 --> 00:21:31.437 a a separate slot of like, yeah, we should have gotten you before you got 00:21:31.520 --> 00:21:34.437 turned out of Goldman and like said, "Dude, this is like that's a waste of 00:21:34.520 --> 00:21:38.797 your time. You could be building something important." And uh >> What else goes 00:21:38.880 --> 00:21:41.157 would be a part of the good outcome? 00:21:41.240 --> 00:21:45.677 >> Well, the the the most important part of a good outcome is we show our 00:21:45.760 --> 00:21:49.357 adversaries you can't with us and we're the best we're the best military 00:21:49.440 --> 00:21:52.157 in the world. Hope I believe we're doing that right 00:21:52.240 --> 00:21:56.837 now. On the good outcome side, we yeah, we go around and then on the commercial 00:21:56.920 --> 00:22:00.397 side, we go to all these high infrastructure, you know, hospitals, 00:22:00.480 --> 00:22:04.237 manufacturing, all these things complicated infrastructure and we AI 00:22:04.320 --> 00:22:07.477 enhanced all of them so the prox are legitimately the best in the world and 00:22:07.560 --> 00:22:10.877 we rebuild manufacturing in this country. Like a big problem for us 00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:14.037 including on the battlefield is our manufacturing just is not up to where we 00:22:14.120 --> 00:22:18.717 have to be. And that by the way requires reskilling 00:22:18.800 --> 00:22:22.477 scaling humans and we're doing this all over the place. I mean, the guy writing 00:22:22.560 --> 00:22:25.357 a lot of the scripts for the target these people. They're like high school 00:22:25.440 --> 00:22:28.477 college grads, the people building batteries and all these things using our 00:22:28.560 --> 00:22:31.717 products. These are high school college grads. There's a lot of opportunity 00:22:31.800 --> 00:22:35.397 there. But, you know, one of the things I told the Germans and I would say to us 00:22:35.480 --> 00:22:37.357 is we I was like you know, in Germany 00:22:37.440 --> 00:22:39.397 you have to call it a crisis. We do need 00:22:39.480 --> 00:22:44.397 like this is a crisis moment. America is in tomorrow is not going to look like it 00:22:44.480 --> 00:22:48.757 looked at all or we're going to have radicalism on right or left. The the the 00:22:48.840 --> 00:22:52.357 problem the danger is if we don't do these reforms you are going to get the 00:22:52.440 --> 00:22:55.717 pitchforks because that then the only solution people are going to have is 00:22:55.800 --> 00:22:59.437 well, you know, let's go after the unlikable rich people in tech especially 00:22:59.520 --> 00:23:02.517 AI tech. And then but but then what can 00:23:02.600 --> 00:23:04.397 work is you have close the borders, keep 00:23:04.480 --> 00:23:07.597 them closed, start doing huge vocational 00:23:07.680 --> 00:23:10.037 efforts, change how we test aptitude. 00:23:10.120 --> 00:23:14.117 Like so we have an accurate diagnostic of where you could be slotted. Uh be 00:23:14.200 --> 00:23:18.197 ruthless and like, you know, it's it's like in in certain find out new ways to 00:23:18.280 --> 00:23:21.997 test and do ruthless testing and slotting. And then also go around to 00:23:22.080 --> 00:23:25.197 universities and just I mean, you know how when you like you want to smoke a 00:23:25.280 --> 00:23:28.117 cigarette, it's like this this cigarette may be harmful to you. Maybe we should 00:23:28.200 --> 00:23:32.117 be putting that in universities. This university This This university 00:23:32.200 --> 00:23:35.197 [laughter] is harmful for your investment. You know, I'm libertarian. 00:23:35.280 --> 00:23:38.667 >> This This student debt may be harmful to your future financial health. 00:23:38.750 --> 00:23:41.037 >> [laughter] >> for your and your personal life. Explain 00:23:41.120 --> 00:23:45.277 to somebody you got a million dollars in debt. Yeah, million dollars in debt. I 00:23:45.360 --> 00:23:47.477 mean, maybe if you're 6'9 and you >> [laughter] 00:23:47.560 --> 00:23:50.597 >> you can get away with that, but the rest of us have to provide. 00:23:50.680 --> 00:23:54.837 >> That's funny. Uh help me square this idea. You you were you were talking 00:23:54.920 --> 00:23:56.957 earlier today about people 00:23:57.040 --> 00:23:59.917 misunderstanding your business. And yet 00:24:00.000 --> 00:24:03.997 >> to read about your business? [snorts] >> Oh, I mean, first of all, it's Oh, I 00:24:04.080 --> 00:24:06.197 mean, the part I used I I hated but then 00:24:06.280 --> 00:24:08.037 the part I love is 00:24:08.120 --> 00:24:11.197 and it's like your valuable 00:24:11.280 --> 00:24:15.437 your your value is pretty directly con- 00:24:15.520 --> 00:24:18.677 convergent with people's inability to understand what you're doing. 00:24:18.760 --> 00:24:22.277 >> Yeah. >> So it's like it's like all these technologies are potentially 00:24:22.360 --> 00:24:23.957 commodifying everything. >> Yeah. 00:24:24.040 --> 00:24:27.157 >> Okay. So, if you are a business that is, 00:24:27.240 --> 00:24:29.557 you know, not services, not product, but 00:24:29.640 --> 00:24:32.117 both, but also works on tribal knowledge 00:24:32.200 --> 00:24:37.317 on data. And every single business you make is individual. And so, yeah, that's 00:24:37.400 --> 00:24:41.237 a crazy valuable business. >> a lot of industries where if the broader 00:24:41.320 --> 00:24:45.197 business community doesn't understand your business, you might have a short 00:24:45.280 --> 00:24:47.917 report, but you'll have a way less competition because people aren't 00:24:48.000 --> 00:24:49.837 copying you because they don't understand the playbook. 00:24:49.920 --> 00:24:54.997 >> to copy certain like like in in in we we neglect this. Like, you know, um 00:24:55.080 --> 00:24:58.437 almost like uh you even see it culturally luxury products dominated by 00:24:58.520 --> 00:25:02.157 the French, watches dominated by the Swiss, currently certain kinds of war 00:25:02.240 --> 00:25:05.997 fighting dominated by America. And it's like it's it's very hard for people to 00:25:06.080 --> 00:25:07.837 eviscerate these cultural advantages. 00:25:07.920 --> 00:25:12.277 And our products augment that, which makes it uh you know, augments the the 00:25:12.360 --> 00:25:17.477 differentiated specific over the generalizable. And and and that's where 00:25:17.560 --> 00:25:18.837 literally all the value's going to go. 00:25:18.920 --> 00:25:20.437 And it's going to be like a waterfall. 00:25:20.520 --> 00:25:23.277 And that that's the problem with a lot of software companies that's like it's 00:25:23.360 --> 00:25:28.677 like product ABC-T. But um but but then when you read it, it's like 00:25:28.760 --> 00:25:31.757 uh like one of the more depressing things that you guys probably confront, 00:25:31.840 --> 00:25:35.197 but it's like a market market huge market opportunity for you is like where 00:25:35.280 --> 00:25:39.157 are the experts? Like it's like you know, it's like there's it's like 00:25:39.240 --> 00:25:42.037 you know, you you hope and pray like I'll tell you the funniest thing about 00:25:42.120 --> 00:25:46.037 my life now and people internally know almost every day I'm like, "Wait a 00:25:46.120 --> 00:25:49.007 minute. I'm the adult in the room here?" 00:25:49.090 --> 00:25:51.917 >> [laughter] >> It's like everywhere I go, it's like 00:25:52.000 --> 00:25:54.477 it's like, "Wait a minute. I uh like I 00:25:54.560 --> 00:25:59.237 and it's like there it it's like and and it speaks so it's it's surreal when you 00:25:59.320 --> 00:26:02.917 read about these things, but and it it used to really frustrate me, but now I 00:26:03.000 --> 00:26:06.037 kind of just think, "Well, like I can't believe we're still viewed 00:26:06.120 --> 00:26:08.837 as crazy." It's like everything we're doing is the only thing that's working. 00:26:08.920 --> 00:26:11.197 I mean, like I don't want to like spend 00:26:11.280 --> 00:26:16.157 a lot of time on our ball our essential essentially ball our numbers from last 00:26:16.240 --> 00:26:18.997 year, but it's like you know, 00:26:19.080 --> 00:26:24.157 clearly our works. Clearly nothing is working at that level. 00:26:24.240 --> 00:26:26.957 And you would think they would take like I don't know, 10 minutes to think, 00:26:27.040 --> 00:26:29.957 "Okay, well, the thing I believed and I thought would work didn't work at all. 00:26:30.040 --> 00:26:33.557 But this thing I thought was insane is guys [clears throat] like a rule of 127 00:26:33.640 --> 00:26:38.517 when like no one like 40 is considered like and like but they don't and and and 00:26:38.600 --> 00:26:42.277 and and and I yeah, but it it's sometimes frustrating honestly. And the 00:26:42.360 --> 00:26:47.157 hard part actually is I kind of view it as a feature. Uh 00:26:47.240 --> 00:26:50.437 internally we get these bright-eyed kids. It's so it's so funny. I mean, 00:26:50.520 --> 00:26:52.717 they one of the get the best people in the world. 00:26:52.800 --> 00:26:54.877 >> Mhm. >> But you know, just like I was probably 00:26:54.960 --> 00:27:00.117 at 21, they're very romantic. It's like, but why does the adult not understand 00:27:00.200 --> 00:27:03.637 this? It's like, but but but the adult expert 00:27:03.720 --> 00:27:06.557 tells me it's like, I don't know when you guys had to drop the shoe moment 00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:10.887 when you realized that like the adults are like, you know, on crack or something. 00:27:10.970 --> 00:27:14.877 >> [laughter] >> Like, it's >> Okay. Uh last question. 00:27:14.960 --> 00:27:16.997 Would you rather have $10 million 00:27:17.080 --> 00:27:19.957 or access to chat GPT in 2012? It's a 00:27:20.040 --> 00:27:24.680 viral question. It's going viral right now. 00:27:25.380 --> 00:27:27.437 >> [laughter] >> I have to choose one or the other. I 00:27:27.520 --> 00:27:30.537 mean, okay. I'm just I don't think it needs >> I don't think it needs 00:27:30.620 --> 00:27:32.517 >> [laughter] >> 10 million. >> I don't think it needs 10 million. Can I 00:27:32.600 --> 00:27:34.717 Can I have my social life in grad school? 00:27:34.800 --> 00:27:36.557 >> There we go. [laughter] Okay. So that's your pick. 00:27:36.640 --> 00:27:38.317 >> How about How about your new pick? 00:27:38.400 --> 00:27:39.597 >> We just have to ask you the question. 00:27:39.680 --> 00:27:42.597 >> you know, it's like, great. I'm going to I'm going to take something I valued. 00:27:42.680 --> 00:27:44.637 >> Oh, okay. >> Yeah. >> The most valuable thing. 00:27:44.720 --> 00:27:45.837 >> Yeah. Your social life in grad school. 00:27:45.920 --> 00:27:48.197 Well, thank you so much for taking the time to come chat with us. It's 00:27:48.280 --> 00:27:51.037 fantastic. Great to have you. We'll see you soon. 00:27:51.120 --> 00:27:54.317 >> Vampire Dracula here. If you found value in this video, please smash the like 00:27:54.400 --> 00:27:57.477 button. Let me know your favorite part of the video by commenting below. And 00:27:57.560 --> 00:27:58.837 most importantly, don't forget to 00:27:58.920 --> 00:28:05.000 subscribe and ding that bell. Until next time, keep it real.