1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,397 Yeah, yeah, get in here class. This is good. Okay, 2 00:00:03,480 --> 00:00:07,357 how is it going? How is ARP con this time around? What's changed? 3 00:00:07,440 --> 00:00:10,317 >> Um, well, we're in a phase. All each one 4 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:14,037 of these things like marks a time. First of all, you guys are even more ball or 5 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:16,117 more successful. >> Thank you. 6 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:17,197 >> Some tendies in your pocket. 7 00:00:17,280 --> 00:00:21,077 >> I think it might have been part two you got to say thank you. You blew us up. 8 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:24,117 You were the biggest guest. >> You're looking bigger and stronger 9 00:00:24,200 --> 00:00:26,397 somehow. [laughter] Hey, are you more attractive in your 10 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:29,237 personal life now randomly? >> Well, here's what we're actually focused 11 00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:32,197 on dead hangs. >> Yeah, so you came on last time you said 12 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:33,837 your dead hangs around like five. 13 00:00:33,920 --> 00:00:37,437 >> Oh, no. It's it's well, it's plateaued in the last couple months at 5:30. 14 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:41,237 >> 5:30. Okay, so we the thing is like people are going to 15 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:44,717 hear that. They're going to think hanging on a bar how long could it be? 16 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:47,557 You got to go and do it. The audience has to go try to do it. We've started 17 00:00:47,640 --> 00:00:50,397 doing it. We're still in the >> Under two minutes. 18 00:00:50,480 --> 00:00:54,917 >> in one between yeah, between somewhere around a minute 30 you feel like your 19 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:59,517 tendons are going to rip. >> 30 1:30 dead hang is respectable. 20 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:01,517 >> Okay. >> Two minutes is super elite. 21 00:01:01,600 --> 00:01:04,797 >> It doesn't feel respectable when you have the five minute number you're 22 00:01:04,880 --> 00:01:08,197 looking at the time. >> Strength strength strength matters. Now, 23 00:01:08,280 --> 00:01:11,797 the the the thing is I don't want to go into rabbit hole in training. The single 24 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:15,797 biggest mistake people make is they try to hang every day. You need recovery 25 00:01:15,880 --> 00:01:20,197 second thing else. So, if you want to mimic and get progress, you just do what 26 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:23,277 I do which is once a week you hang as long as you can. Doesn't have to be 27 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:25,837 super macho. And then that's your day. 28 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:27,677 So, let's just say you can do 1:30. 29 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:30,557 >> sets? >> No, no, you know, one day a week you do your maximum. 30 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:32,677 >> Maximum. Wow. >> So, like let's say you could do two 31 00:01:32,760 --> 00:01:34,997 minutes. You try to do at least 1:30. 32 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:37,397 You fight to get to 1:30, but you don't fight to get to two minutes. 33 00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:39,237 >> Got it. >> That's your dead hang day. And then you 34 00:01:39,320 --> 00:01:42,237 can basically [__] around the next day and do whatever you want. Don't overdo 35 00:01:42,320 --> 00:01:47,077 it, but you could do two times one minute with a long break. And then can't 36 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:50,797 you just screw around and do less and less and less. Two days before if you 37 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:55,237 two minute dead hang you do like four times 15 seconds. The day before before 38 00:01:55,320 --> 00:01:58,637 off. And you do that. just keep doing that, 39 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:02,407 and your day What The mistake people make is they hear my ball or time. 40 00:02:02,490 --> 00:02:05,557 >> [laughter] >> [__] that guy. I'm going 41 00:02:05,640 --> 00:02:08,597 >> I mean, the mistake you're making is not doing a course. This could be a whole 42 00:02:08,680 --> 00:02:12,117 new revenue Wait, you guys I mean, you guys have a 43 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:15,557 war for you guys. You could be like, "Hey, call in." 44 00:02:15,640 --> 00:02:19,717 >> So, um yeah, I mean, the dead hang is that it's like And also, some of it's 45 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:24,117 just genetic. Like, my other metrics are elite, but that this is somehow alien 46 00:02:24,200 --> 00:02:28,717 territory. God-given gift. >> What about What about breath hold under water? 47 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:32,317 >> I don't do that, and I'm not sure I have a Like, I grew up swimming. I I think 48 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:36,437 I'm weaker at that. Like, I bet you I would be in your guys' >> [laughter] 49 00:02:36,520 --> 00:02:39,717 >> I I I'm a I'm a dive master. I can hold my breath for 3 minutes. 50 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:42,037 >> I'm just say I'm just say So, I think you'd be like 51 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:44,797 I think you'd be crushing me on that, honestly. But, you have like the lung 52 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:46,237 capacity of a whale. >> That's true. That's true. 53 00:02:46,320 --> 00:02:47,757 >> I mean, like >> Yeah. >> You got like you got 54 00:02:47,840 --> 00:02:50,197 >> Yeah, if I'm not moving, I'm not using any oxygen. 55 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:51,757 >> It's like you're like you're like you're 56 00:02:51,840 --> 00:02:55,557 like a like a like a whale floating out there [laughter] under the 57 00:02:55,640 --> 00:02:57,557 waiting to surface. >> That's true. 58 00:02:57,640 --> 00:02:59,117 >> So, you know, I'll say I'll tell you the 59 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:02,957 difference. Uh it is just I got they're always minding me out there. But, like 60 00:03:03,040 --> 00:03:05,037 okay, when we first met, it was like, 61 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:08,957 "AI maybe real." Okay. Then, I would say 62 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:14,477 somehow until about 2 weeks ago, there was like a holy [__] this is real, but 63 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:17,237 somehow it's not working, but we're not allowed to say it publicly cuz we'll 64 00:03:17,320 --> 00:03:20,237 look stupid. And then there's a lot of investor hype. 65 00:03:20,320 --> 00:03:22,477 >> Yep. >> Um there still is like investors 66 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:26,117 printing tendies. So, you have the investors on one side. I think people 67 00:03:26,200 --> 00:03:31,317 realize it's real, but you know, it's like you know, you have the whole token maxing. 68 00:03:31,400 --> 00:03:33,957 >> Yep. >> And people are on onto that. And then 69 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:35,997 so, there's a whole value lecture there. 70 00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:40,277 Um uh you have a political situation 71 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:44,837 um where, you know, people who do not understand basic economics 72 00:03:44,920 --> 00:03:48,317 are winning the political argument. So, you can you could we could talk about 73 00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:50,157 where AI >> Yeah, there's a lot here. Let's break it 74 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:53,557 Let's break it up. Let's start with the token maxing thing. Let's start with 75 00:03:53,640 --> 00:03:57,797 what's what's real. How are you actually thinking about 76 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:00,797 deploying AI >> First of all, what what is your what is 77 00:04:00,880 --> 00:04:04,117 what is Palantir's philosophy around token consumption? 78 00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:07,477 >> Well, like we okay, we have a product that will allow you to be able I mean, 79 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:11,917 internally it's called something, but externally, but really we 80 00:04:12,000 --> 00:04:16,397 call it the de-masturbatory like get off masturbation thing internally. 81 00:04:16,480 --> 00:04:19,477 >> It's like >> People are just like print like sitting 82 00:04:19,560 --> 00:04:23,757 there all day kind of like a porn addiction, and enterprises are like, 83 00:04:23,840 --> 00:04:28,637 "Okay, we knew this we believe this will create value, but we cannot have people 84 00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:31,557 just like some people >> checking the weather with it, just like 85 00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:35,157 and just re-re-rearranging deck chairs on their personal Titanic. 86 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:40,717 >> literally like porn. >> Like people are like full on >> It feels it feels so 87 00:04:40,800 --> 00:04:43,197 >> objects, right? >> Tool-shaped objects you're looking at 88 00:04:43,280 --> 00:04:46,477 more than you want. You hope no one notices. You're kind of before dinner 89 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:49,957 after dinner. >> Yeah, and every email classified with tags. 90 00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:55,357 >> It comes down to like business problems can never be I mean, sometimes they can 91 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:58,797 be solved purely with money and just spending more, but very often 92 00:04:58,880 --> 00:05:01,237 >> Actually, I think it's the opposite. So, just to give you a weird analogy 93 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,117 >> No, and I was going to say very very often it's more the opposite where it's 94 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:08,037 about figuring out the right way to do something, and then you can use capital 95 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:09,757 to fuel that process, but 96 00:05:09,840 --> 00:05:15,117 >> Let me give you a thing that's sui generis for you guys. Okay. It it it's 97 00:05:15,200 --> 00:05:20,357 taste plus money. >> Okay. >> And there is no the like AI Like if you 98 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:23,597 look at like to pick any issue we want to talk about. Token maxing is a 99 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:26,557 maxing uh what's going on with deploy 100 00:05:26,640 --> 00:05:28,717 codes. Are other people going to build 101 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:32,117 ontologies? Why are why why does the our 102 00:05:32,200 --> 00:05:36,437 political class not understand AI, especially in Europe? It's like, "Yes, 103 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:39,917 because all of these things can be scaled in a very valuable, but largely 104 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:45,317 going to commoditized way. But you can't scale the taste of like, "What is the 105 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:48,677 business problem you want to have to solve and need to solve? At the end of 106 00:05:48,760 --> 00:05:51,837 the day, whether it's in the four whether it's the Ukrainians fighting, 107 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:56,037 the Israelis, commercial entities, it's there's somebody sitting there who's 108 00:05:56,120 --> 00:05:59,957 like, "Okay, but this problem is valuable. This problem isn't." And once 109 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:03,557 that value that problem is always has that problem 110 00:06:03,640 --> 00:06:06,717 alway almost always but not always has attributes. So, there are some problems 111 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:10,477 you could solve with this like, "I want to write a report on GDP growth in 112 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:14,117 China, right?" Okay, but if it's a problem that requires a knowledge store, 113 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:17,637 like I want to understand the specialized way I underwrite. We're 114 00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:21,677 going to have a guest here. I want to understand the specialized way I drill 115 00:06:21,760 --> 00:06:24,797 for oil and gas that's both legal, ethical, and reduces the cost of 116 00:06:24,880 --> 00:06:29,877 production. I want to change the the the supply chain of my industry, whether 117 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:33,717 that's military or whether that's building boxes, or whether that's cars. 118 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:38,437 These things require actual precise, ongoing processes. 119 00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:41,237 They are enhanced by large language models. 120 00:06:41,320 --> 00:06:44,357 They are not replaced by large language models. And then you get to security 121 00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:48,077 issues like But for us like the whole myth of things is it's just a boon 122 00:06:48,160 --> 00:06:52,357 because like yeah, we can take any model, their model, 123 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:54,957 OpenAI model, open model, we can 124 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:57,517 identify we can now identify 125 00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:02,437 vulnerabilities at like 10 100x. Yeah, but then who patches them? Yeah. How do 126 00:07:02,520 --> 00:07:06,757 you patch them on prem? How do you patch them on prem so that your specialized 127 00:07:06,840 --> 00:07:10,237 knowledge stays on prem? Like if you're any business or intel service, there's a 128 00:07:10,320 --> 00:07:11,717 lot of these things are very similar. 129 00:07:11,800 --> 00:07:16,277 Like you're not putting your classified data in a public cloud. Yeah. Same thing 130 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:20,517 if you're like, you have a special way of farming soybeans. Well, you're not 131 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:24,957 So, it's like how do you have how do you get So, all these problems are exposed, 132 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,477 identified, and then you always have a thing of where's the 133 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:32,637 charisma, which people really underestimate. And it's it's not global. 134 00:07:32,720 --> 00:07:36,357 There's no global charisma now. Like So, right now the large language models are 135 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:40,437 very Frontier companies are super charismatic with investors. 136 00:07:40,520 --> 00:07:43,677 >> Mhm. >> I'll give you some news. They're super 137 00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:46,637 not un-charismatic with enterprises and the people. 138 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:48,637 >> Yeah. >> In a way even with enterprise. 139 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:50,477 >> No, no. I mean it's >> Cuz I understand with the people. 140 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,757 >> no. The enterprise people I have a secret I have a secret like every 141 00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:57,197 company has a secret way of selling. You know what my secret way of selling is? 142 00:07:57,280 --> 00:08:01,517 Don't even call it don't don't come talk to us. There's a frontier company. Go 143 00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:05,357 spend 2 days with them. And if you're lucky after you're done, I'll let you in 144 00:08:05,440 --> 00:08:07,197 my door. They're like [laughter] clamoring. 145 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:09,917 >> Yeah. >> They're like hey, I'll take your bad brand. 146 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:11,717 >> Yeah. >> We have a great brand in enterprise. But 147 00:08:11,800 --> 00:08:15,117 like it it's like it's like secret knowledge cuz the investors love this. 148 00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:17,997 They're like hey, my stocks are all up everything's up. I mean Palantir's done 149 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:21,437 very well. We're like it but it's like and you know you guys are doing very 150 00:08:21,520 --> 00:08:23,077 well I imagine, right? And it's okay. 151 00:08:23,160 --> 00:08:26,797 We're we're you know we can but I'll tell you what you go down the street you 152 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:30,717 talk to a marine, you talk to a bus driver, you talk to the person who owns 153 00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:33,237 the bus driving company. >> Mhm. 154 00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:37,157 >> They are not happy. They do not like these people. They're tired of people 155 00:08:37,240 --> 00:08:38,477 token maxing. >> Yeah. 156 00:08:38,560 --> 00:08:44,237 >> It it looks like masturbation at their that's cost them money. They they're 157 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:46,437 like and honestly then you have something we're not allowed to talk 158 00:08:46,520 --> 00:08:47,997 about in this country likeability. 159 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:50,477 >> Mhm. >> Like Palantir, we have I think we have 160 00:08:50,560 --> 00:08:53,997 like 50 100 million global bands. We have like 5 million people that wake up 161 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:56,357 in the morning literally calling me Satan. 162 00:08:56,440 --> 00:08:59,037 >> Mhm. >> I didn't know I had that kind of >> Mhm. 163 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:02,277 >> warm hand. But uh you know it's like that's what they believe. 164 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:04,717 >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And like and they really believe it. 165 00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:09,397 Okay. What people are not allowed to really address is like we have fans and 166 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:11,597 enemies. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> These people are polarizing. 167 00:09:11,680 --> 00:09:13,637 >> Yeah. >> We're polarizing which means both sides. 168 00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:14,837 >> Yep. >> These people have one side. 169 00:09:14,920 --> 00:09:19,797 >> Yep. >> They're just it is so it's like you and then it's like it's a really big 170 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:21,557 >> Social media companies too have the same problem. 171 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:23,517 >> Yeah, no. >> Everyone uses them but no one likes them. 172 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:27,077 >> Yeah, but but then they also live in a circle and that circle's printing money. 173 00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:28,917 >> Yep. >> So it's like you know when you look in 174 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:32,757 the mirror and you just printed a lot of money you look pretty fresh. 175 00:09:32,840 --> 00:09:37,757 >> Is part of it is is part of it that that some element of the technology, let's 176 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:41,957 just say LLM's, is so magical that 177 00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:45,437 the companies involved, that the companies that are making and selling 178 00:09:45,520 --> 00:09:48,677 frontier intelligence, can be bad at a bunch of other things and still grow. 179 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:51,677 >> Well, no. No, no. They are magical at a 180 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:55,997 certain kind of thing, allowing you to write, for example, code. Now, that code 181 00:09:56,080 --> 00:09:59,557 doesn't can't be used as a knowledge store. So, if you look at code in like 182 00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:02,357 three different ways, like just using pound as a model. We have code that's 183 00:10:02,440 --> 00:10:05,077 basically infrastructure. So, what what are the Ukrainians using? What is the 184 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:08,557 Department of War using? What do a lot of our enterprises that that we call 185 00:10:08,640 --> 00:10:11,877 that primitives? So, they're basically hard-coded things that that understand 186 00:10:11,960 --> 00:10:16,357 the world. Well, way do you do? It would take millions of technical hours and an 187 00:10:16,440 --> 00:10:19,717 understanding of all these enterprises to do it. So, it's it's much more like 188 00:10:19,800 --> 00:10:21,557 how do you build a steel beam? Then you 189 00:10:21,640 --> 00:10:25,597 have like code that is written by FDEs. 190 00:10:25,680 --> 00:10:30,277 Okay, so that's kind of managed. It's The reason why FDEs work, the secret is 191 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:33,277 it's actually managed in something that we as a product. So, you're writing to a 192 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:36,077 code base for managing that. We're increasing our product. It's not just 193 00:10:36,160 --> 00:10:40,557 random people writing. Then you have, let's call it free code. That free code 194 00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:44,557 is that's magical. Like you can do it very quickly. It's almost right. It 195 00:10:44,640 --> 00:10:46,397 doesn't have to be exact. >> Dashboards. 196 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:49,037 >> Dashboards, financial stuff, >> Little little flow stuff. 197 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:51,877 >> probabilistic stuff where you you just have to get it >> One-off analysis. 198 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:55,117 >> it was it magical. >> Yep. >> By the way, it's magical and not only 199 00:10:55,200 --> 00:10:58,917 creates it and it's magical in a way I don't I don't know people like the porn 200 00:10:59,000 --> 00:11:02,317 thing, but it's also addicting. It's like you know it's not good for you, but 201 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:04,597 you know, it may lead to damage. 202 00:11:04,680 --> 00:11:06,917 >> One more time. It can't hurt that much. 203 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:11,077 I know my doctor says it I shouldn't do it. But it's like it's like that, right? 204 00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:14,597 And you just keep going and like and if you're involved in the that thing, 205 00:11:14,680 --> 00:11:16,437 you're also making money. >> Yeah. 206 00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:18,237 >> And then, last not least, in certain 207 00:11:18,320 --> 00:11:20,917 circles, like if you have you want to be 208 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:25,717 a research researcher or you believe, essentially it's a religion. So, like, 209 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:28,557 you know, and like one of the things is very charismatic, especially people 210 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:31,757 who've never had a religion, cuz all of a sudden that hole in your heart that 211 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:33,877 was yearning for I don't know. I would 212 00:11:33,960 --> 00:11:36,597 say, you know, a a established religion, 213 00:11:36,680 --> 00:11:39,517 Judaism, Christianity, Islam is like 214 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:43,917 being filled. And and all the answers are there. But it is very very 215 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:46,237 successful at doing things that a 216 00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:47,957 company has to do. 217 00:11:48,040 --> 00:11:51,397 But it is not actually solving the 218 00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:55,037 problem that enterprises are. It is Now, it can solve them. That's the trick. 219 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:58,477 It's not It's not binary. It's not like You can't say they're not valuable. 220 00:11:58,560 --> 00:12:00,237 They're totally putting our business on 221 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:03,597 steroids. Like without LLMs, nobody 222 00:12:03,680 --> 00:12:09,077 would be talking about our ontology, about Apollo managing secure exploits, 223 00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:12,677 about our ability to manage an enterprise essentially, uh turning all 224 00:12:12,760 --> 00:12:16,117 these companies into FDEs. These deploy codes, we love them cuz now every 225 00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:18,757 company wants to deploy code. You know how you do that? 226 00:12:18,840 --> 00:12:22,437 You re-platform on Palantir. And like and it actually works. It's not somebody 227 00:12:22,520 --> 00:12:25,157 with no taste who's never done enterprise, who has no earthly clue how 228 00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:28,237 these things work, who's done something else and is like just imagining they 229 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:29,637 know how to do it, right? 230 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:32,397 >> Yeah, is part is part of this moment 231 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:35,477 quite entertaining for you because 232 00:12:35,560 --> 00:12:37,717 you guys have been working on 233 00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:39,997 understanding businesses at a deep 234 00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:43,277 fundamental level, creating 235 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:47,037 You guys have effectively been doing the work that it that 236 00:12:47,120 --> 00:12:49,797 people are promising AI could do for 20 237 00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:51,837 years now, but actually doing it, 238 00:12:51,920 --> 00:12:57,277 finding all the really rough finding all the really rough edges and 239 00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:00,717 uh and not and and being at a point where you don't have to oversell the 240 00:13:00,800 --> 00:13:02,517 technology. You can sell both things. 241 00:13:02,600 --> 00:13:07,477 But now there's maybe Here we go. We got it together. Um 242 00:13:07,560 --> 00:13:11,037 now there's maybe >> Oh, it's the wrong side. That's why. 243 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:14,997 Flip it around. >> There you go. 244 00:13:15,080 --> 00:13:19,480 There you go. There you go. Living the dream. Living the dream. 245 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:24,437 >> I I trailed off, but uh but is part of it entertaining to you that it feels 246 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:29,117 like you You Palantir has always been in some 247 00:13:29,200 --> 00:13:32,197 ways um not had competitors because there's 248 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:35,197 nobody with Alex Karp running a company 249 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:39,397 that is does what Palantir does besides Palantir. But at the same time, there's 250 00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:42,477 been tens of billions of dollars deployed now 251 00:13:42,560 --> 00:13:46,477 to effectively do what Palantir does, but 252 00:13:46,560 --> 00:13:51,157 just selling the intelligence part, not selling all the underlying kind of 253 00:13:51,240 --> 00:13:53,157 infrastructure that you guys >> Well, they're doing two things. They're 254 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:56,837 selling They're trying to sell the intelligence part and they're trying to 255 00:13:56,920 --> 00:13:59,597 pretend if you just hire a bunch of people and let them run around their 256 00:13:59,680 --> 00:14:02,917 FTEs. Now, the the very cool thing is 257 00:14:03,000 --> 00:14:04,597 when you've been in your 258 00:14:04,680 --> 00:14:07,717 basement doing your thing and everyone 259 00:14:07,800 --> 00:14:12,117 kind of use it as the freak show, it it's really interesting and and and 260 00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:14,637 great to have adoption. The pretty uh 261 00:14:14,720 --> 00:14:17,477 ironic thing is half the people adopting 262 00:14:17,560 --> 00:14:21,917 now don't even know they're copying. But now, the copying thing it helps and 263 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:27,197 hurts. Where it hurts is in the beginning it puts clutter in the market. 264 00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:29,197 >> Yeah. >> Um and there's there's no doubt about 265 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:33,877 it. Where it helps and then we saw this with defense tech, honestly. So like in 266 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:37,437 defense tech, we were the only people we're the first people despite what it's 267 00:14:37,520 --> 00:14:41,877 I I love these honestly other podcasters. They're interviewing people 268 00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:44,877 who are parroting things I said 20 years ago they don't know it. And it's like, 269 00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:47,637 "Oh, that's so insightful." It's like, "Yeah, of course it's insightful. Karp 270 00:14:47,720 --> 00:14:51,237 said it 25 years ago." >> [laughter] >> Uh and like but it's it's but so that 271 00:14:51,320 --> 00:14:54,037 kind of that part is super weird. But uh 272 00:14:54,120 --> 00:14:57,597 and like but um but it's but what really 273 00:14:57,680 --> 00:15:01,677 happens we see is like it expands the market. So like in defense tech, we 274 00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:05,917 would not be doing this well in just purely in government unless 275 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:09,957 there weren't 50 companies that were doing similar things because then the 276 00:15:10,040 --> 00:15:13,757 people are like, "Okay, first of all, >> You view it as like off-balance sheet 277 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:17,517 sales resources where people are basically doing it themselves. 278 00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:19,557 >> now that that's the largely it's They do 279 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:24,717 two things. They increase the size of the market because de facto nobody wants 280 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:27,997 to find it under in a market where there's only one person. Sure. So like 281 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:31,837 if you're the one person, the percentage of the defense budget you can get is 282 00:15:31,920 --> 00:15:36,397 much smaller. And two, they set up a comparator. It's like, you know, you may 283 00:15:36,480 --> 00:15:40,277 not like the freak show. Okay. If like but have you noticed the 284 00:15:40,360 --> 00:15:44,077 people who are serious buy it? And then then it it change and then three it 285 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:48,957 changes the standard. Now, what you're seeing now is like that times a 100x. 286 00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:51,117 >> Yeah. >> And it does change like recruiting, 287 00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:55,277 retention, and like how you build a company and we're always think you have 288 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:58,197 to think about how to being dyslexic huge advantage there cuz like you don't 289 00:15:58,280 --> 00:16:01,637 have a playbook and now that we need you need things to shift and we're doing that. 290 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:02,597 >> Um 291 00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:05,437 >> The the the central thing though that 292 00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:10,317 it's just cannot be developed it even if you understood the playbook a lot of 293 00:16:10,400 --> 00:16:14,037 these things are like appear like it's like, you know, LM code appears like 294 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:17,597 Palantir code but isn't for a deployed thing appears like Palantir it isn't. 295 00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:21,997 Ontology you could a theoretically copy parts of it but they're essentially 296 00:16:22,080 --> 00:16:25,837 structures that are built deep into organizations that we own. And by the 297 00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:29,557 way, take you 3 years. And then 3 years we're in a completely different world. 298 00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:34,917 But there is this magical thing called taste. Like it in the end of the day the 299 00:16:35,000 --> 00:16:36,477 reason why you guys have done so well. 300 00:16:36,560 --> 00:16:39,277 It's of course there's aptitude and diligence 301 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:41,437 and showing up and all those things. 302 00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:45,237 Yeah, but you have to be able to differentiate between two people who are 303 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:48,517 in business one of whom is saying something that sounds weird that is 304 00:16:48,600 --> 00:16:52,357 insightful. One of whom is parroting something that sounds weird and that's 305 00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:56,797 all they're doing. And a lot of people very few people can do that. And it's 306 00:16:56,880 --> 00:16:59,277 the same thing like the enterprises that 307 00:16:59,360 --> 00:17:02,757 succeed there is a taste arbiter. And at 308 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:05,517 Palantir we have taste we have taste in 309 00:17:05,600 --> 00:17:09,797 every product, taste in every deployment, taste in every casting. Who 310 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:12,557 puts the people there? How do you put them there? How do you organize the 311 00:17:12,640 --> 00:17:15,997 thing? Our ontology then does that technically. How do you manage the whole 312 00:17:16,080 --> 00:17:18,077 org with taste? Who should be in charge? 313 00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:21,277 What data sets should come in? What What are What are the ways in which you 314 00:17:21,360 --> 00:17:25,157 protect What is What should you push into the public crowd? What should be on 315 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:27,197 prem? What What should I mean, leaving 316 00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:32,197 aside the law and like wars war ethics, what do you want to protect? What should 317 00:17:32,280 --> 00:17:35,757 you protect? What should you not protect because quite frankly, you want that to 318 00:17:35,840 --> 00:17:37,557 be out there so you can get more data. 319 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:40,917 All those things are arbitrated by taste and then you have to have the 320 00:17:41,000 --> 00:17:44,917 credibility of having taste. That's a real problem for a lot of these 321 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:47,517 places cuz they don't have They They're popular with their friends. They don't 322 00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:50,857 They really don't understand how unpopular they are in enterprise. Like 323 00:17:50,940 --> 00:17:53,157 [laughter] they think it's like, "Oh, yeah, it's like the way I think I have a 324 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:54,757 problem with like professors at 325 00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:57,277 Columbia." It's like, "No, it's a real 326 00:17:57,360 --> 00:18:02,197 problem." Like they think I'm Satan. And you know, it's like I I I I think, you 327 00:18:02,280 --> 00:18:03,277 know, we grew up in the same community. 328 00:18:03,360 --> 00:18:06,317 Let's talk about Heidegger. They're like they don't want to talk about Heidegger. 329 00:18:06,400 --> 00:18:10,237 So, it's like it's like Yeah, and so that's just a It's a weird thing. It's 330 00:18:10,320 --> 00:18:12,277 going to be a super The one thing I 331 00:18:12,360 --> 00:18:15,477 would say for anyone listening, 332 00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:19,797 if you're listening to this and you're chillaxing and not active I'm not saying 333 00:18:19,880 --> 00:18:21,957 you have to agree with me politically or anything. 334 00:18:22,040 --> 00:18:26,157 There the like partly because of this dynamic and it very self-inflicted 335 00:18:26,240 --> 00:18:29,157 because I I I tell you I can't name names. I 336 00:18:29,240 --> 00:18:33,397 called many of the titans of this world and and 337 00:18:33,480 --> 00:18:36,397 like started this 6 months ago like every couple days. 338 00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:37,437 We're going to be nationalized. 339 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:40,317 >> them every couple days? >> Uh like some of them I'm like, "Yeah, 340 00:18:40,400 --> 00:18:42,557 we're going to be I mean, you know, it's like honestly they're like the batch 341 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:44,397 They They They find me very entertaining." [clears throat] Like I'm 342 00:18:44,480 --> 00:18:47,797 not sure Like so they call cuz yeah, it's like it's like Yeah, this is going 343 00:18:47,880 --> 00:18:48,957 to be entertaining. >> to pick up. 344 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:53,397 >> Yeah, so in any case, so I've been telling them for 6 months 6 We're going 345 00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:55,677 to be nationalized. >> Yeah. Yeah, you talked about 346 00:18:55,760 --> 00:18:58,797 >> We're going to be nationalized. And they're like, "Why would anyone 347 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:00,877 nationalize? Never happened in America. 348 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:04,757 It's never Why would anyone nationalize us? We're so likable. We're creating so 349 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:08,957 much value." Like, "Okay, I'm not going to debate that. I know how likable I am. 350 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:12,517 I'm not going to tell you how likable you are. But I am telling you and you 351 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:16,877 know the momentum on this is on the side of people in national and we don't get 352 00:19:16,960 --> 00:19:20,277 our act together and figure out ways we can say, "Hey, look, there are problems 353 00:19:20,360 --> 00:19:23,157 here. We're going to deal with these things that are not going to Yes, they 354 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:26,477 are going to create opportunities. You have to talk openly about how these 355 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:28,957 things are valuable because we have adversaries. You can't just say these 356 00:19:29,040 --> 00:19:33,517 are All that stuff." So, the primary risk, honestly, to Palantir and to a lot 357 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:37,677 of these other countries is And then, it's going to be nationalized before 358 00:19:37,760 --> 00:19:40,197 national is going to be regulated by people who don't understand understand 359 00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:43,037 this. And now, they'll tell you in private, "I'm working on this. I'm da da 360 00:19:43,120 --> 00:19:46,797 da and this and this lobbyist." It's like, "Not going to work." So, like, 361 00:19:46,880 --> 00:19:49,077 that's something like if you're listening to this and you're like, 362 00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:52,837 "Look, you know, you don't have to agree with me on all my proclamations. I got a 363 00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:55,637 lot of By the way, there's some people who think I'm saying we should have a 364 00:19:55,720 --> 00:19:59,197 draft." Too lazy to read. I'm just saying we should Like, in a world where 365 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:02,757 everything is changing, everything is changing. 366 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:06,197 Don't we have to find some communal structure to remember we're American? 367 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:09,797 You don't like my You don't like my idea of like we all do a week in the park. 368 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:11,957 Great. Come up with some other idea. 369 00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:15,277 But, we can't have no idea. You know, and like and then they're like, "Well, 370 00:20:15,360 --> 00:20:17,117 I'm saying I I do not want to draft." 371 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:20,197 Just to be explicit. They're like, "Oh, that's pro-war." Now, honestly, you know 372 00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:23,397 what most of our wars are fought because no working-class person is making a 373 00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:26,877 decision. You start making sure everyone is involved in everything. I'll see you 374 00:20:26,960 --> 00:20:30,797 how few wars we fight. It's actually the anti-war position. But, any case, 375 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:32,957 disagree with everything. If you're We 376 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:38,117 have on the right and on the left people people who have no earthly clue what 377 00:20:38,200 --> 00:20:39,677 they're talking about, right and left. 378 00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:43,037 All they're talking about is how much they hate us. And those of us who are 379 00:20:43,120 --> 00:20:46,797 sensible in the middle, you know, too many of us are chillaxing. 380 00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:51,437 Like, it Like, nationalization, it can't happen. It's America would never do that. 381 00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:54,917 Sleepwalking into And you guys have tendies to protect now. You [laughter] 382 00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:58,437 guys should be on the front line of this. Like, you got full Oh, I'm sorry. 383 00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:02,997 I have a I have a full-on very impressive corporate leader coming on. 384 00:21:03,080 --> 00:21:04,917 >> Yes. >> So, I got to I got to turn it down. 385 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:07,757 >> Last Last question if we have time. 386 00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:10,677 How are your conversations going with 387 00:21:10,760 --> 00:21:13,917 Fortune 500 CEOs around headcount 388 00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:17,797 planning? There's been so many layoffs this last year that people were saying, 389 00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:19,277 "Hey, we're getting so much out of AI. 390 00:21:19,360 --> 00:21:21,277 We're able to, you know, cut back here 391 00:21:21,360 --> 00:21:22,437 or there." 392 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:27,037 People inside tech often know like these 393 00:21:27,120 --> 00:21:31,597 maybe there's just reduction because there needs to be a reduction. The org 394 00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:34,997 got bloated. Maybe they do need to fund some AI initiatives. 395 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:37,357 >> business model like they're getting out competed by someone else. Yeah, yeah. 396 00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:38,997 Yeah, the business just doesn't have momentum. But how are those 397 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:40,997 conversations going? >> What does it look like? 398 00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:44,317 >> Like the like I talk By the way, I talk to Fortune 500 companies. I talk to 399 00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:47,837 unions. I talk to soldiers. I talk to fire 400 00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:52,837 If you upskill somebody, they're more valuable. And like all 401 00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:56,197 these whether it's people working on batteries, people driving trucks, 402 00:21:56,280 --> 00:22:00,077 people, corporate leaders, and again, this is where I think we have to be very 403 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:03,517 careful to be more disciplined on the corporate side. Like if you run around 404 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:07,477 saying AI allowed you to fire 2/3 of your workforce and you did it because 405 00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:10,197 maybe your competitor's kicking your ass. 406 00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:14,517 That could that is a really like you might as well just go sign up for Bernie 407 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:18,637 Bernie Sanders manifest. And part of the thing is they really believe that can't 408 00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:22,397 happen. So they're free riding on the fact that it could. Like we have And 409 00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:25,797 then it just cannot work anymore. These things are very, very explosive. The 410 00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:29,757 American people sense that there is something dangerous here. And when 411 00:22:29,840 --> 00:22:33,597 people are playing with that fire, it's like it's a they assume the fire won't 412 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:36,437 burn their hands. Well, that's not the world we're in. That fire is going to 413 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:39,397 consume us. And what we see again, the 414 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:41,437 war-fighting example is just the most 415 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:46,477 neutral, not for everybody. But like the soldiers at the bottom have gotten much 416 00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:49,117 more valuable. Well, and and I don't even just mean the special operators, 417 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:52,997 which obviously they're in a different league. But like every the people doing 418 00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:56,317 a lot of the operations now are doing our product their high school 419 00:22:56,400 --> 00:23:01,117 vocationally trained. You see this everywhere. The the modern enterprise is 420 00:23:01,200 --> 00:23:03,237 going to have like we have a 421 00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:06,997 a true like very very very smart 422 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:10,637 person coming on and it's like you're going to have a very smart executive. 423 00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:14,437 He's much better at hiding it than I would be if I were him, but that's you 424 00:23:14,520 --> 00:23:16,957 can talk to him about that. But um 425 00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:19,477 uh um and 426 00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:22,477 uh and then very talented creative 427 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:26,517 people with taste all up and down the stack. In any case, I think this is time 428 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:29,437 for me to >> this is time. >> We uh >> Thank you so much. 429 00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:33,240 >> Great to be here. >> Yeah, always fun.