WEBVTT 00:00:03.840 --> 00:00:06.077 We were the freak show and [music] we 00:00:06.160 --> 00:00:08.557 spent 20 years for this moment. 00:00:08.640 --> 00:00:14.237 >> We're doing it. We're doing it. And I'm sure you're enjoying this as much as I 00:00:14.320 --> 00:00:18.237 am. >> If you were a cupcake, what kind of cupcake would you be? 00:00:18.320 --> 00:00:23.080 >> I don't want to be a cupcake cuz I don't want to get eaten. 00:00:27.440 --> 00:00:31.037 >> Alex Karp, welcome to Sorcery. I'm happy to be here. 00:00:31.120 --> 00:00:33.117 >> Well, we're fresh off of earnings. 00:00:33.200 --> 00:00:36.157 Palunteer has hit $500 billion recently. 00:00:36.240 --> 00:00:39.277 Just released a new biography. How are you feeling? 00:00:39.360 --> 00:00:42.797 >> Um, I feel really good. Um, 00:00:42.880 --> 00:00:45.277 you know, look, we started the company 00:00:45.360 --> 00:00:48.957 with a lot of ideas that uh were really 00:00:49.040 --> 00:00:53.757 exceedingly controversial until about two years ago. FDES, everyone thought 00:00:53.840 --> 00:00:57.357 that would destroy your company. uh being fully meritocratic. Everyone 00:00:57.440 --> 00:00:59.117 thought you're not supposed to do that. 00:00:59.200 --> 00:01:02.317 Um uh low hierarchy, almost no one does 00:01:02.400 --> 00:01:05.277 that. So like like Eleano and I were 00:01:05.360 --> 00:01:07.357 only separated by one layer, which is 00:01:07.440 --> 00:01:10.477 fictional because like we talk and it's 00:01:10.560 --> 00:01:14.317 a very very flat hierarchy. Um we were 00:01:14.400 --> 00:01:16.317 uh we thought we should give America an 00:01:16.400 --> 00:01:18.477 unfair advantage uh in government first 00:01:18.560 --> 00:01:21.357 and then in commercial. Um, we built 00:01:21.440 --> 00:01:25.597 these products more like artistic things 00:01:25.680 --> 00:01:30.237 years before anyone thought their relevance. PG, the anti-terror product. 00:01:30.320 --> 00:01:32.397 Uh, Gaia, the product that most special 00:01:32.480 --> 00:01:34.877 operations use in the world. Um, 00:01:34.960 --> 00:01:39.437 Foundry, uh, ontology, Apollo, Maven. 00:01:39.520 --> 00:01:41.447 >> Uh, and we're still a freak show. 00:01:41.530 --> 00:01:45.197 [laughter] Uh and you know if you walk around here like the crazy thing about 00:01:45.280 --> 00:01:47.437 Palunteer is you know I I I get invited 00:01:47.520 --> 00:01:50.637 to like I meet lots of companies and we 00:01:50.720 --> 00:01:54.557 you know big companies small companies private companies commercial companies 00:01:54.640 --> 00:01:57.437 the most famous people in the world some 00:01:57.520 --> 00:02:01.837 people should be famous but luckily for them aren't. And I would say Palanteer 00:02:01.920 --> 00:02:03.677 like feels like if you walk around here 00:02:03.760 --> 00:02:07.277 it's like uh kind of a startup vibe. I 00:02:07.360 --> 00:02:11.117 mean but but but with scale and the the thing that's special about Palanteer I 00:02:11.200 --> 00:02:16.157 mean my version externally is we gave venture returns not just venture returns 00:02:16.240 --> 00:02:17.837 we gave venture returns as if you're 00:02:17.920 --> 00:02:20.477 like you know I don't know you're you 00:02:20.560 --> 00:02:25.197 like Peter Teal Seoia Koslow returns 00:02:25.280 --> 00:02:28.557 to the average person who is willing to 00:02:28.640 --> 00:02:31.437 do their own work and stand up against 00:02:31.520 --> 00:02:34.797 uh uh kind of tried but not true ideas 00:02:34.880 --> 00:02:38.637 like playbooks. So, we're like the antiplaybook company and then, you know, 00:02:38.720 --> 00:02:43.197 I mean, you know, I'm currently in a battle with, you know, short sellers 00:02:43.280 --> 00:02:45.517 primarily because they could go short 00:02:45.600 --> 00:02:48.237 some carcinogenic company, but they have 00:02:48.320 --> 00:02:52.957 to short arguably the best company in this country and in the world by any 00:02:53.040 --> 00:02:57.277 metric. And by the way, judge us by our enemies. Look who hates us. Like, I 00:02:57.360 --> 00:03:01.677 mean, like, go online. I mean, I guess people here have gone on X. Like, just 00:03:01.760 --> 00:03:04.557 forget any you don't need to know anything else. just look at like who 00:03:04.640 --> 00:03:08.637 hates Palenteer and look who hates me and then judge us by that standard. What 00:03:08.720 --> 00:03:10.317 should our market cap be based on that 00:03:10.400 --> 00:03:13.437 standard? So, um I don't know. I'm very 00:03:13.520 --> 00:03:18.077 proud uh of where we are. Um I believe I 00:03:18.160 --> 00:03:21.997 know it's the way beginning, you know, internally we're kind of a very young 00:03:22.080 --> 00:03:24.077 company. >> I mean, I don't mean just in terms of 00:03:24.160 --> 00:03:26.877 age, which is also true, but it's just a 00:03:26.960 --> 00:03:30.797 young fresh vibe. We've anti-aged. 00:03:30.880 --> 00:03:32.717 >> You've reached anti-aging. We've reached 00:03:32.800 --> 00:03:34.957 anti-aging. It's either Well, I do think 00:03:35.040 --> 00:03:38.237 uh age of company is directly correlated 00:03:38.320 --> 00:03:41.357 with the rate of age or anti-aging is 00:03:41.440 --> 00:03:44.077 directly correlated with the layers of 00:03:44.160 --> 00:03:46.717 hierarchy. Our company is 20 years old 00:03:46.800 --> 00:03:49.597 and feels like it's has scale of a 00:03:49.680 --> 00:03:54.077 20-year company, but the vibe of a four or 5year-old company. Meaning, we know 00:03:54.160 --> 00:03:57.197 what we're doing. We have a way of doing things. It's very tribal. We're we stick 00:03:57.280 --> 00:04:00.237 to our tribal knowledge. But it's you 00:04:00.320 --> 00:04:02.957 know like for example you know we put 00:04:03.040 --> 00:04:05.917 the whole companies we bet on the US 00:04:06.000 --> 00:04:10.717 military and on the US commercial sector and we pivoted the whole company to both 00:04:10.800 --> 00:04:15.117 basically I mean that we still have a massive presence outside of America but 00:04:15.200 --> 00:04:19.437 we've been and like we can do we can make these decisions 00:04:19.520 --> 00:04:23.837 like in like somebody we la this marriage meritocracy uh thing which is 00:04:23.920 --> 00:04:27.437 basically to give people who are tired of being discriminated against an 00:04:27.520 --> 00:04:32.397 application process a chance to come and learn something useful. Uh, and the 00:04:32.480 --> 00:04:34.637 people always say, "How long did it take to launch that?" And I was like, "Yeah, 00:04:34.720 --> 00:04:39.037 I don't know. Three minutes." >> Three minutes. 00:04:39.120 --> 00:04:41.197 >> Yeah. It's like decision. I don't know. 00:04:41.280 --> 00:04:44.477 Like a lot of like I was we were talking about this before, but like 00:04:44.560 --> 00:04:46.797 >> the it's it's hard to be fair to the 00:04:46.880 --> 00:04:49.437 total barereft of common sense and in in 00:04:49.520 --> 00:04:54.157 practice not particularly honest analyst expert class. Not because they're wrong 00:04:54.240 --> 00:04:57.597 the first time, but primarily because they can't admit they were wrong the 00:04:57.680 --> 00:04:58.957 first time when they're wrong the 10th 00:04:59.040 --> 00:05:01.917 time. But if you want to be slightly 00:05:02.000 --> 00:05:07.037 fair to them, this company runs on like a much more artistic. 00:05:07.120 --> 00:05:10.877 It's more much more artistic than science. So >> where does that come from? 00:05:10.960 --> 00:05:15.277 >> Um, you know, I obviously primarily from my mom was a professional and 00:05:15.360 --> 00:05:19.837 world-class artist. And again, everyone says they're an artist, 00:05:19.920 --> 00:05:21.677 but then there's a very big difference 00:05:21.760 --> 00:05:25.117 between a glacial difference between 00:05:25.200 --> 00:05:29.037 like my mom is a above one rule of 100 00:05:29.120 --> 00:05:31.837 artists like you know it's like in in a 00:05:31.920 --> 00:05:36.557 very different sphere and then on my father's side they were heavily involved 00:05:36.640 --> 00:05:37.917 in commercial art 00:05:38.000 --> 00:05:40.157 >> and like textiles for like a thousand 00:05:40.240 --> 00:05:43.677 years. So like and what what people 00:05:43.760 --> 00:05:47.357 always think of like the lay person thinks of art is you just doodle 00:05:47.440 --> 00:05:52.397 something but I know it's crazy but uh you're from like an artistic family like 00:05:52.480 --> 00:05:53.997 that's what people think but actually 00:05:54.080 --> 00:05:57.197 art is you you tap into something very 00:05:57.280 --> 00:05:59.597 very deep that is not understood about 00:05:59.680 --> 00:06:01.197 the period of time you're in 00:06:01.280 --> 00:06:04.557 >> and does not become understood until 00:06:04.640 --> 00:06:09.917 like 20 30 years later. And that art 00:06:10.000 --> 00:06:11.757 captures 00:06:11.840 --> 00:06:14.477 something in the zeitgeist that is so 00:06:14.560 --> 00:06:19.357 special, but then the depth also transmutes to like something more 00:06:19.440 --> 00:06:23.917 universal. >> Do you think that's how Palunteer is being viewed right now? 00:06:24.000 --> 00:06:27.277 >> Well, no. I mean, I think people like I think I think one of the one of the 00:06:27.360 --> 00:06:31.277 crazy things about our society is people who are more on the front line like 00:06:31.360 --> 00:06:34.157 soldiers, workers, 00:06:34.240 --> 00:06:37.757 uh vocational workers. um what we call 00:06:37.840 --> 00:06:43.037 retail investors, they're actually looking at the frontline data in an 00:06:43.120 --> 00:06:44.637 unfiltered way 00:06:44.720 --> 00:06:47.357 >> and then almost everybody else has 00:06:47.440 --> 00:06:51.037 outsourced value assessment and 00:06:51.120 --> 00:06:54.157 quantitative metrics to experts 00:06:54.240 --> 00:06:59.277 >> but the experts in general generalization are I can't think of any 00:06:59.360 --> 00:07:00.877 expert class that's been right about 00:07:00.960 --> 00:07:03.597 anything substantive in the last 20 00:07:03.680 --> 00:07:06.717 years and then so at this point when 00:07:06.800 --> 00:07:10.797 you're like when the experts call the experts the analysts in this case or 00:07:10.880 --> 00:07:13.277 journalists or I don't know you're a 00:07:13.360 --> 00:07:15.597 financial analyst for a paper a hedge 00:07:15.680 --> 00:07:19.197 fund like you are actually a medium and 00:07:19.280 --> 00:07:22.557 it's your job to transfer the reality on 00:07:22.640 --> 00:07:26.557 the ground into a reality you can understand. Yeah. But the reality you 00:07:26.640 --> 00:07:28.797 can understand is not reality. And like 00:07:28.880 --> 00:07:31.197 but then because there's like it's like 00:07:31.280 --> 00:07:35.277 a a super unique uh bubble, they can't 00:07:35.360 --> 00:07:39.437 quite allow themselves to say, "Yeah, but" and so but one of the greatest 00:07:39.520 --> 00:07:42.797 trends is like I mean at the end of the day, what makes one of the things that 00:07:42.880 --> 00:07:45.117 makes a great artist great is they have 00:07:45.200 --> 00:07:47.677 a vision of what they see in the world 00:07:47.760 --> 00:07:50.797 and they stick to that vision. Although 00:07:50.880 --> 00:07:52.477 everybody in the world said, "You can't 00:07:52.560 --> 00:07:55.197 paint like that. You can't write like 00:07:55.280 --> 00:07:58.637 that. You can't you can't picture 00:07:58.720 --> 00:08:02.557 photography that way. Uh because it doesn't I don't know. Then and then by 00:08:02.640 --> 00:08:08.397 the way, most great artists like my mother end up with no money. 00:08:08.480 --> 00:08:11.037 >> Yeah. >> And uh I mean that's the the book has 00:08:11.120 --> 00:08:15.917 like a lot of TDS in it. But I mean it is true. We were not economically 00:08:16.000 --> 00:08:20.237 privileged. But you could look at it as like but why were we not economically 00:08:20.320 --> 00:08:21.837 privileged? Because like my parents have 00:08:21.920 --> 00:08:25.117 these super high level of intellect. 00:08:25.200 --> 00:08:29.117 Yeah. But it's also because they kind of stuck to their guns of how they saw the 00:08:29.200 --> 00:08:33.277 world and that's where the experts are like, you know, like this isn't safe 00:08:33.360 --> 00:08:36.477 because in almost all cases this doesn't work. Yeah, they're right. But in the 00:08:36.560 --> 00:08:39.117 one case where you change the world, it's the only way it can work. 00:08:39.200 --> 00:08:43.197 >> Is this why you're so committed to the American worker and even in the recent 00:08:43.280 --> 00:08:45.837 re earnings call you called out you're 00:08:45.920 --> 00:08:47.997 giving venture returns to retail 00:08:48.080 --> 00:08:50.557 investors? you've created a really 00:08:50.640 --> 00:08:56.397 amazing cult behind Wall Street Bets and a lot of retail. So, how do you feel 00:08:56.480 --> 00:08:58.637 about retail? >> Well, I think you know I always think 00:08:58.720 --> 00:09:00.317 there's the economic and there's the 00:09:00.400 --> 00:09:03.037 psychological and really powerful things 00:09:03.120 --> 00:09:07.837 are aligned. So, like you know I I in no 00:09:07.920 --> 00:09:12.397 way like I hate these victimhood BS things and and honestly when you're 00:09:12.480 --> 00:09:16.637 almost everyone who believes in that is a mark whether they realize it or not. 00:09:16.720 --> 00:09:21.357 But I mean like they may not realize it but you are the mark and like uh and 00:09:21.440 --> 00:09:25.117 that's frustrating because a lot of these people who believe in that really 00:09:25.200 --> 00:09:26.877 deserve better but it's hard to give 00:09:26.960 --> 00:09:28.717 better if you believe in an ideology 00:09:28.800 --> 00:09:32.557 that can't work. But um 00:09:32.640 --> 00:09:35.597 I did come from an environment and where 00:09:35.680 --> 00:09:38.877 it was not expected that I would be 00:09:38.960 --> 00:09:43.757 co-founder and have a butt for role in building arguably one of the greatest 00:09:43.840 --> 00:09:47.517 companies ever built. And I don't mean that even like in like the half trillion 00:09:47.600 --> 00:09:51.037 dollar market cap or whatever it is or I just mean in terms of how it's changed 00:09:51.120 --> 00:09:53.277 the lives primarily of Americans on the 00:09:53.360 --> 00:09:56.957 battlefield as investors and also um you 00:09:57.040 --> 00:09:59.597 know um on the on on the factory floor. 00:09:59.680 --> 00:10:02.397 But the thing is, if you come from 00:10:02.480 --> 00:10:05.117 nothing and you're this amorphous, 00:10:05.200 --> 00:10:08.317 racially dyslexic person from a very 00:10:08.400 --> 00:10:10.797 specific kind of culture, not even 00:10:10.880 --> 00:10:13.757 Jewish culture, it's like superbicger 00:10:13.840 --> 00:10:18.557 Germanic left-wing culture, you 00:10:18.640 --> 00:10:20.957 assume the world may not work out for 00:10:21.040 --> 00:10:22.717 you and is definitely not looking out 00:10:22.800 --> 00:10:28.317 for you. Okay. So, what other group of people in this culture have exactly the 00:10:28.400 --> 00:10:31.677 same vibe? Yeah. Soldiers, people on the factory 00:10:31.760 --> 00:10:34.237 floor. Who does the dying and bleeding 00:10:34.320 --> 00:10:36.317 for us? Soldiers, people on the factory 00:10:36.400 --> 00:10:41.357 floor. Who gets killed because somehow constitutional legal scholars only read 00:10:41.440 --> 00:10:44.957 the Constitution so it's expansive to protect their rights. So their right to 00:10:45.040 --> 00:10:48.957 be happy, their right to be go to Yale, their right to be wealthy, their right 00:10:49.040 --> 00:10:51.117 to be safe. But somehow the constitution 00:10:51.200 --> 00:10:53.997 cannot be read to stop the reality of 00:10:54.080 --> 00:10:58.317 like in the last two years more people have died of fenol than every single 00:10:58.400 --> 00:11:03.037 person who's died in as a soldier since World War II. But they they can't and 00:11:03.120 --> 00:11:06.877 and part of it is like they have a lot of intellectual re reasons, but the real 00:11:06.960 --> 00:11:11.997 reason is they don't see themselves as having had the same fate. But if you're 00:11:12.080 --> 00:11:16.317 me, you you look at those people and then quite frankly look look at the US 00:11:16.400 --> 00:11:18.717 Army. Look who fought and died 00:11:18.800 --> 00:11:21.837 >> for our rights today. By the way, it so 00:11:21.920 --> 00:11:25.357 it and it was like it and it was mostly 00:11:25.440 --> 00:11:28.317 workingass people from what the elite 00:11:28.400 --> 00:11:31.517 calls flyover states. It still is. Um 00:11:31.600 --> 00:11:35.677 and then look at the US military. It integrated first to integrate, first to 00:11:35.760 --> 00:11:40.157 bring me. It still fights for meritocracy. The first major institution 00:11:40.240 --> 00:11:42.557 in the world to say, I don't care where 00:11:42.640 --> 00:11:45.277 you're from. and they did it way before 00:11:45.360 --> 00:11:47.677 American society. So that's that 00:11:47.760 --> 00:11:52.397 version. Then there's the economic stability version. My version of what 00:11:52.480 --> 00:11:56.397 and we by the way what a fair thing to ask people is what were you saying 10 00:11:56.480 --> 00:11:58.557 years ago? Right? So one of the most 00:11:58.640 --> 00:12:03.677 amazing things about Palunteer like is and you know this but like you go online 00:12:03.760 --> 00:12:06.957 and people who like you know whatever some people don't like my vast words of 00:12:07.040 --> 00:12:11.037 wisdom and they're like he's saying this now. What did he say 10 years ago? Like 00:12:11.120 --> 00:12:15.277 we are saying this, we've been saying this for 20 years. Close the border. Get 00:12:15.360 --> 00:12:19.037 rid of the identity politics. Victimhood It's especially bad for the 00:12:19.120 --> 00:12:22.877 for people who need it. Uh have a strong military. Make that military the 00:12:22.960 --> 00:12:26.317 strongest of the world. Give an unfair advantage to America. Do not treat all 00:12:26.400 --> 00:12:31.117 cultures of equal. Simultaneously do not get on the whole neocon make the whole 00:12:31.200 --> 00:12:34.557 world like America thing because it doesn't work. Be skeptical of 00:12:34.640 --> 00:12:37.357 immigration. uh built technology will be 00:12:37.440 --> 00:12:42.397 the determinant variable in who runs the world. All the stuff you're learning at 00:12:42.480 --> 00:12:46.557 Berkeley about people are just going to inherently absorb American values is 00:12:46.640 --> 00:12:50.477 really just downstream from our military superiority. You don't know that, but 00:12:50.560 --> 00:12:52.717 our adversaries absolutely know that. 00:12:52.800 --> 00:12:56.637 We've been saying this for 20 years. And the only difference now is people who 00:12:56.720 --> 00:12:59.677 are skeptical of us are forced to realize we could be right, which is why 00:12:59.760 --> 00:13:01.917 they run to short sellers and analysts 00:13:02.000 --> 00:13:04.317 who still can't gro where we're at. 00:13:04.400 --> 00:13:07.197 There was a part in the book where you 00:13:07.280 --> 00:13:12.317 had just won the Dwight Eisenhower award and this was a little bit of a surprise 00:13:12.400 --> 00:13:16.317 to your employees but you got a little choked up because of the impact of what 00:13:16.400 --> 00:13:19.757 that is >> to troops and so could you just explain 00:13:19.840 --> 00:13:21.917 what that experience was like for you? 00:13:22.000 --> 00:13:24.397 >> Well, first of all, Eisenhower has his 00:13:24.480 --> 00:13:26.317 German name. He's from a German 00:13:26.400 --> 00:13:30.637 religious minority family. He uh de he 00:13:30.720 --> 00:13:33.517 was a a pivotal peri figure at gunpoint 00:13:33.600 --> 00:13:36.157 in desegregation. He helped win the war 00:13:36.240 --> 00:13:39.437 or pivotal um and but the the main thing 00:13:39.520 --> 00:13:43.117 is you know it's I lived in Germany for 00:13:43.200 --> 00:13:46.477 a lot of my adult life uh which was a 00:13:46.560 --> 00:13:50.717 phenomenal experience which maybe they went into in too much graphic detail. 00:13:50.800 --> 00:13:52.077 >> What are you talking about? 00:13:52.160 --> 00:13:56.637 >> We don't know. It's like uh it was um I went for the right reasons and I may 00:13:56.720 --> 00:13:58.637 have stayed for the wrong reasons, but 00:13:58.720 --> 00:14:02.317 it's okay. I uh and I so I have um a lot 00:14:02.400 --> 00:14:06.317 of uh a deep understanding and and I'll 00:14:06.400 --> 00:14:09.837 get to this and deep appreciation for the German culture. I think one of the 00:14:09.920 --> 00:14:14.637 craziest things is you have this whole thing online where people like like law 00:14:14.720 --> 00:14:16.637 the Nazis like I spend a lot of time 00:14:16.720 --> 00:14:19.437 talking to Nazis like real Nazis and 00:14:19.520 --> 00:14:23.837 like understanding what made them tick and what made them I mean part of the 00:14:23.920 --> 00:14:27.677 crazy thing about people the Nazis nowadays is there's not a single Nazi 00:14:27.760 --> 00:14:30.157 that would ever have included them in their movement and would have shipped 00:14:30.240 --> 00:14:32.877 them off to the camps quicker maybe than 00:14:32.960 --> 00:14:35.917 they shipped me off to the camps. Uh but 00:14:36.000 --> 00:14:38.237 um and uh and it's like it's uh but 00:14:38.320 --> 00:14:42.317 thing that is crazy unique about America 00:14:42.400 --> 00:14:45.917 whether it's you know somebody from 00:14:46.000 --> 00:14:48.477 Montana 00:14:48.560 --> 00:14:51.197 >> Iowa 00:14:51.280 --> 00:14:54.557 going over to fight 00:14:54.640 --> 00:14:56.237 >> because they believed in America and 00:14:56.320 --> 00:14:59.037 they believed in the greater good and 00:14:59.120 --> 00:15:04.077 there really was this was a primarily 00:15:04.160 --> 00:15:06.397 moral All it's like honestly it's like 00:15:06.480 --> 00:15:11.277 Lincoln. This guy fought to end slavery. 00:15:11.360 --> 00:15:13.997 It was not economic. It was moral. 00:15:14.080 --> 00:15:15.037 >> Mhm. 00:15:15.120 --> 00:15:18.717 >> Like what other culture actually engaged 00:15:18.800 --> 00:15:23.677 in civil war just because it was wrong 00:15:23.760 --> 00:15:27.437 >> what was happening in the south. That was the primary I'm not like the modern 00:15:27.520 --> 00:15:31.037 way of reading is like economics. It's like if 00:15:31.120 --> 00:15:35.117 maybe but the primary reason why Americans fought and died was moral. 00:15:35.200 --> 00:15:39.117 Primary reason why Americans fought and died in World War II was moral and it 00:15:39.200 --> 00:15:41.517 would they had no tethering. Like when 00:15:41.600 --> 00:15:43.437 you're a soldier from the north dying to 00:15:43.520 --> 00:15:47.597 fight slavery. It's not that you have I 00:15:47.680 --> 00:15:48.957 don't know black relatives and friends. 00:15:49.040 --> 00:15:50.477 It's because you think this is wrong. 00:15:50.560 --> 00:15:53.357 when you were over uh fighting uh the 00:15:53.440 --> 00:15:56.637 Nazis or Imperial Japan, you were doing 00:15:56.720 --> 00:16:01.197 it because you thought America was a superior way of living and this wasn't 00:16:01.280 --> 00:16:05.837 wrong. Now you can and like and then whatever one thinks about these things, 00:16:05.920 --> 00:16:09.517 no other culture does this. It's the same thing of how did we get meritocracy 00:16:09.600 --> 00:16:12.797 until recently in America? Merritocracy 00:16:12.880 --> 00:16:14.957 is a like one of the things that we 00:16:15.040 --> 00:16:16.957 don't often value enough like even now 00:16:17.040 --> 00:16:20.637 in Europe like like in Europe if when we 00:16:20.720 --> 00:16:24.717 I was involved in hiring at uh this institute I worked at and one of the 00:16:24.800 --> 00:16:29.117 biggest problems was I was always like of course we need to hire the best 00:16:29.200 --> 00:16:33.917 person that's not the way it works in Germany or Norway like the best person 00:16:34.000 --> 00:16:38.317 doesn't get hired ever >> and so like you know like at our 00:16:38.400 --> 00:16:42.637 institutions like at our elite institutions we embrace meritocracy. We 00:16:42.720 --> 00:16:44.557 embrace the higher good and we fought 00:16:44.640 --> 00:16:48.477 and died for that. Like one of and and 00:16:48.560 --> 00:16:53.357 then the fact that Palunteer can bring that kind of person home more safely and 00:16:53.440 --> 00:16:57.437 arguably whether people believe this or not we can you know the primary purpose 00:16:57.520 --> 00:17:01.357 of Palunteer is to be so dominant that those people don't have to fight and die 00:17:01.440 --> 00:17:05.277 because everyone knows you're going to die 10 times more if you attack America. 00:17:05.360 --> 00:17:08.077 You want to sleep at night. You want to make sure our soldiers don't have to 00:17:08.160 --> 00:17:11.277 fight and die. make sure the adversary knows they are gonna get totally effed 00:17:11.360 --> 00:17:13.517 up if they if they screw with us. And 00:17:13.600 --> 00:17:18.397 that's that's like a really noble purpose. 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That's certy. 00:19:44.480 --> 00:19:48.637 One thing that was apparent through the narrative of the book was you're 00:19:48.720 --> 00:19:50.637 self-made, but you're not self-made in 00:19:50.720 --> 00:19:52.557 an economic sense. You're self-made in 00:19:52.640 --> 00:19:55.677 maybe a morals and values sense. So, how 00:19:55.760 --> 00:19:59.837 did you become Alex Cart? 00:19:59.920 --> 00:20:01.597 >> Well, I mean, you know, there's the 00:20:01.680 --> 00:20:04.317 there's all these variables. Very smart 00:20:04.400 --> 00:20:08.957 parents, highly educated, crappy school, which I never would have done. Like, you 00:20:09.040 --> 00:20:10.717 know, it's like and so you learn like 00:20:10.800 --> 00:20:15.437 the world is violent. um uh dyslexia 00:20:15.520 --> 00:20:18.637 meaning there's no playbook I could possibly follow. I think so one of the 00:20:18.720 --> 00:20:22.317 reasons why dyslexics are so outperformant now is that we're in a 00:20:22.400 --> 00:20:25.837 non-playbook world and the playbook's not that valuable but if you're dyslexic 00:20:25.920 --> 00:20:28.077 you can't you can't follow the playbook 00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:29.917 or only in a third rate way. So you in 00:20:30.000 --> 00:20:36.920 you invent new and generative things. Um I 00:20:37.200 --> 00:20:40.877 >> um I look I've never been accused of 00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:44.317 false ill modesty. I think in the end 00:20:44.400 --> 00:20:48.717 for to do something important whether it's me or like Elellaniano or look at 00:20:48.800 --> 00:20:52.797 all these people here like these are among the best and most talented people 00:20:52.880 --> 00:20:54.957 in the world at a certain level of 00:20:55.040 --> 00:20:59.837 accomplishment. you're in an artistic space where it's very hard to explain 00:20:59.920 --> 00:21:01.837 why you have your insights and it goes 00:21:01.920 --> 00:21:03.997 way beyond experiences that have of 00:21:04.080 --> 00:21:06.957 course also influenced them but like I 00:21:07.040 --> 00:21:11.997 just have artistic impulses and they shape my life and I've allowed myself or 00:21:12.080 --> 00:21:16.557 I've been forced to allow myself the freedom to live that way and in there's 00:21:16.640 --> 00:21:18.877 one country in the world where you know 00:21:18.960 --> 00:21:20.717 you get rewarded for that because in 00:21:20.800 --> 00:21:24.957 America if you deliver you can be you 00:21:25.040 --> 00:21:29.437 >> you know like >> you're your own boss, >> right? You decide who you want to talk 00:21:29.520 --> 00:21:30.637 to, you decide you don't want to talk 00:21:30.720 --> 00:21:32.637 to, you have ideas of things you'd like 00:21:32.720 --> 00:21:36.877 to, you know, advance on. Um, and the I 00:21:36.960 --> 00:21:41.197 think one of the biggest variables in my life is just simply I live in a culture 00:21:41.280 --> 00:21:42.717 where if you deliver in this case 00:21:42.800 --> 00:21:45.357 economically and by the way 18 I like 00:21:45.440 --> 00:21:48.317 like for most investors we were failing 00:21:48.400 --> 00:21:50.477 for at least 15 years. 00:21:50.560 --> 00:21:53.517 >> Many would say 18 years. Honestly, some 00:21:53.600 --> 00:21:55.917 would say until two years ago, right? 00:21:56.000 --> 00:21:58.717 And still this is a culture where the 00:21:58.800 --> 00:22:02.157 FDA, ontology, superiority of the West, 00:22:02.240 --> 00:22:05.757 extreme meritocracy, the fact that I would just tell people basically the 00:22:05.840 --> 00:22:10.557 financials are going to show up. You know, that's only possible in this 00:22:10.640 --> 00:22:14.957 culture. And I guess maybe because I lived abroad so long, I was it's easier 00:22:15.040 --> 00:22:18.637 for me to accept and rely on that. I think sometimes people who've lived here 00:22:18.720 --> 00:22:23.037 their whole life don't always exactly understand you. This is a maximal 00:22:23.120 --> 00:22:27.037 freedom culture. It's the only culture like this in the world. And it'll allow 00:22:27.120 --> 00:22:30.717 you to self-express. And if you self-express, that self-expression, 00:22:30.800 --> 00:22:32.637 because it's not playbook, creates an 00:22:32.720 --> 00:22:37.837 environment that is exceedingly hard to compete with and will piss off all the 00:22:37.920 --> 00:22:41.277 right people. >> How is a value creation for Palunteer 00:22:41.360 --> 00:22:44.557 different than traditional SAS companies? 00:22:44.640 --> 00:22:47.517 >> Uh well, here. Okay. So well first of 00:22:47.600 --> 00:22:51.597 all it's important to remember we are value d like we drive our whole business 00:22:51.680 --> 00:22:54.237 based on a set of beliefs that are like 00:22:54.320 --> 00:22:59.197 America superiority and that but but then interestingly that's tethered to 00:22:59.280 --> 00:23:00.717 the value creation argument you're 00:23:00.800 --> 00:23:03.437 asking which is at the end of the day if 00:23:03.520 --> 00:23:06.397 you believe your client is noble like I 00:23:06.480 --> 00:23:08.957 believe our US government clients are 00:23:09.040 --> 00:23:12.237 not only noble but they're no more noble 00:23:12.320 --> 00:23:14.877 than I am and I'm happy with myself but 00:23:14.960 --> 00:23:16.717 they're doing missions 00:23:16.800 --> 00:23:19.437 that are will change world history for 00:23:19.520 --> 00:23:23.197 the better. Okay. So, if you know that 00:23:23.280 --> 00:23:26.637 the thing that's going to happen downstream from that is you're going to 00:23:26.720 --> 00:23:29.277 resist building parasitic products, 00:23:29.360 --> 00:23:34.077 right? Because like I don't want a product that will make me despite what 00:23:34.160 --> 00:23:38.717 anyone but like anyone who's been a Palanteer will know this to be true. We 00:23:38.800 --> 00:23:43.197 I did we did not the audacity of just saying we're going to build a product in 00:23:43.280 --> 00:23:45.037 PG that's going to make you safer. Oh, 00:23:45.120 --> 00:23:47.597 let's go away from the ambient noise. Uh 00:23:47.680 --> 00:23:52.317 um that will make you uh safer 00:23:52.400 --> 00:23:57.277 and more protected is audacious in a weird way that we 00:23:57.360 --> 00:24:00.957 didn't realize. The most audacious part of that was saying we're going to build 00:24:01.040 --> 00:24:03.037 a product that's actually what the client needs. 00:24:03.120 --> 00:24:05.197 >> Mhm. >> Cuz what you're supposed to be doing do 00:24:05.280 --> 00:24:08.877 in software is build the client that the client gets addicted to, not the one 00:24:08.960 --> 00:24:11.837 they need. And like this is like and 00:24:11.920 --> 00:24:15.597 this is absolutely a truism in in in 00:24:15.680 --> 00:24:18.477 software development of any kind. And so 00:24:18.560 --> 00:24:20.317 the like the again the most radical 00:24:20.400 --> 00:24:24.237 thing we ever did was say yeah client or 00:24:24.320 --> 00:24:27.917 in this case partner that we look up to 00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:30.157 has these needs. We didn't even give 00:24:30.240 --> 00:24:32.237 them what they asked for. We gave them 00:24:32.320 --> 00:24:37.517 what they ought to ask for which again is very artistic. It's like like any 00:24:37.600 --> 00:24:41.357 rational business would have said, you know, I don't know, client ABCD wants B. 00:24:41.440 --> 00:24:44.317 At the very least, you just give them what they want. That's kind of what 00:24:44.400 --> 00:24:49.357 integrators do. And then what very successful software companies do is say, 00:24:49.440 --> 00:24:52.317 oh, they think they want X. Well, fake give them X, but we'll give them this 00:24:52.400 --> 00:24:55.037 thing that they can't get rid of. And then nothing else will work, but they'll 00:24:55.120 --> 00:24:58.237 just have to pay. And then I can hire 50,000 salespeople and get these 00:24:58.320 --> 00:25:03.037 wonderful economics. And what and then every single decision like again the FD 00:25:03.120 --> 00:25:07.277 thing, now everyone copies it. But it was the most radical like you had 00:25:07.360 --> 00:25:09.757 everyone making fun of this for 20 years because that meant you were going to get 00:25:09.840 --> 00:25:12.957 a a one multiple and but there was no 00:25:13.040 --> 00:25:15.997 way to extend PG like essentially PG you 00:25:16.080 --> 00:25:20.717 can think of PG as like a precursor to AIP because you have text free text that 00:25:20.800 --> 00:25:25.037 a computer could not understand the NLP technology was primitive. The only way 00:25:25.120 --> 00:25:27.517 to extend that product to like the 00:25:27.600 --> 00:25:32.077 bounds of technology now was to have people doing impulse. And then the only 00:25:32.160 --> 00:25:36.717 way to build the next product or deepen that product was to understand what the 00:25:36.800 --> 00:25:40.157 customer ought to want tomorrow and build that into the product today. Mhm. 00:25:40.240 --> 00:25:43.517 >> And so like that value creation by the 00:25:43.600 --> 00:25:46.077 way it ends up being very very 00:25:46.160 --> 00:25:48.957 protective because and and then because 00:25:49.040 --> 00:25:52.557 the customer partner actually becomes to 00:25:52.640 --> 00:25:57.597 they may not like you like some of our best clients globally both in government 00:25:57.680 --> 00:26:01.437 and in commercial we're like I don't really like these guys. Yeah. But you 00:26:01.520 --> 00:26:05.837 know what? When you bring someone home safely, they learn to love you. 00:26:05.920 --> 00:26:09.517 >> And so, and then that that allows us to have this privileged position that we 00:26:09.600 --> 00:26:14.397 now have. And now when we're launching, you know, when we again there's example, 00:26:14.480 --> 00:26:18.237 the most recent example that people will be more familiar was with would be 00:26:18.320 --> 00:26:22.797 launching AIP. >> Okay. When we launched AIP or I launched 00:26:22.880 --> 00:26:26.397 it in like an artistic I don't know if you know the story, but any case, I 00:26:26.480 --> 00:26:30.797 launched AIP in like the darkness of night. the darkness of night. 00:26:30.880 --> 00:26:36.077 >> Yeah. Okay. >> Yeah. Unlike uh pre-Easter holiday because 00:26:36.160 --> 00:26:39.197 >> it would have been massively resisted and and I would say as one of my 00:26:39.280 --> 00:26:43.357 favorite people said in any other company every the whole head head of 00:26:43.440 --> 00:26:45.917 whatever part of the product that was going to be involved in this would have 00:26:46.000 --> 00:26:47.757 quit because it was just launched. 00:26:47.840 --> 00:26:50.397 >> Mhm. >> It completely artistic like this is 00:26:50.480 --> 00:26:53.757 where the world is going. We have all the components. We had ontology of 00:26:53.840 --> 00:26:55.837 foundry but the components need to be 00:26:55.920 --> 00:26:59.037 brought together. Okay. 00:26:59.120 --> 00:27:03.677 The the thing is if you're working back from what will sell, you would have 00:27:03.760 --> 00:27:06.557 said, well, wait a minute, everyone's saying LLM are going to solve all these 00:27:06.640 --> 00:27:11.917 problems. But I believed and it turns out that LLMs are commodity products and 00:27:12.000 --> 00:27:14.717 orchestration would be much more valuable than the product themselves. 00:27:14.800 --> 00:27:18.317 You need both. We need that we need the LMS. But in reality, and that's part of 00:27:18.400 --> 00:27:21.117 the reason we have these numbers because turns out we're right. 00:27:21.200 --> 00:27:23.917 >> Yeah. But but like if you were working 00:27:24.000 --> 00:27:26.637 back from what experts think and what 00:27:26.720 --> 00:27:33.240 customers are asking for, you do not launch that. You launch something else. 00:27:36.160 --> 00:27:39.037 >> Okay. >> You can ask as many questions as you want. You have 00:27:39.120 --> 00:27:41.117 >> I have one more question. Says Elellaniano. 00:27:41.200 --> 00:27:44.477 >> Okay. You But you you can 00:27:44.560 --> 00:27:48.397 she's the boss. How many questions would you like? 00:27:48.480 --> 00:27:51.117 >> 72. >> Okay. [laughter] Okay. 00:27:51.200 --> 00:27:53.357 >> Um, >> why not? Yeah. 00:27:53.440 --> 00:27:55.917 >> So, on AIP, it seemed like that was a 00:27:56.000 --> 00:28:00.717 big pivotal moment for the company and getting into this next realm of AI, 00:28:00.800 --> 00:28:02.797 which is something in transformation 00:28:02.880 --> 00:28:06.237 that you've embraced fullheartedly 00:28:06.320 --> 00:28:10.237 versus maybe some other people um to the extent that you go into different 00:28:10.320 --> 00:28:13.277 corporations and then you make the products for them 00:28:13.360 --> 00:28:16.237 >> on top of our current products or we build new ones. Yeah, that's true. 00:28:16.320 --> 00:28:20.717 >> Yeah. Would you say that that was a major component to why sales cycles have 00:28:20.800 --> 00:28:23.997 compressed and why it's been easier to sell? 00:28:24.080 --> 00:28:28.477 >> You know, it's it's a really good question. It's it's it it is that, but 00:28:28.560 --> 00:28:32.637 also the zeitgeist has changed. Like although there have been a lot of 00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:34.877 projects in AI that haven't worked. 00:28:34.960 --> 00:28:38.957 >> Yeah, >> most leaders in the corporate world and 00:28:39.040 --> 00:28:42.637 government know of projects that have worked. 00:28:42.720 --> 00:28:44.477 >> Great portion of those are in Palunteer. 00:28:44.560 --> 00:28:47.357 So in the government there's like there's a deep understanding the 00:28:47.440 --> 00:28:49.837 government side of like Maven and other 00:28:49.920 --> 00:28:54.397 things uh hive mind and then on the commercial context we have all these 00:28:54.480 --> 00:28:58.717 very public customers and people begin to see their unit economics changing and 00:28:58.800 --> 00:29:01.997 particularly important they're able to change them while being in the public 00:29:02.080 --> 00:29:05.917 sphere so you can do what you had to do in private by you used to have to buy 00:29:06.000 --> 00:29:09.997 the company take it offline for like 5 years and then scrap the cost and resell 00:29:10.080 --> 00:29:13.277 and then you could do this while remaining public and there's lots of 00:29:13.360 --> 00:29:16.637 economic advantages to that. Um uh and 00:29:16.720 --> 00:29:21.757 so you can also do it in private context. But um and so the the the thing 00:29:21.840 --> 00:29:26.797 that you see as a common through line that in AI on the positive side is it 00:29:26.880 --> 00:29:29.277 used to be no one believed the software would work. M 00:29:29.360 --> 00:29:30.957 >> now everyone believes it should work and 00:29:31.040 --> 00:29:34.637 they wonder well if mine isn't working 00:29:34.720 --> 00:29:37.517 >> where can I find something that is and 00:29:37.600 --> 00:29:40.477 more and more and more people especially 00:29:40.560 --> 00:29:44.637 honestly in the US it's not true in Europe in Europe they're still like it 00:29:44.720 --> 00:29:48.237 doesn't work but hopefully this will fail because it's all American products 00:29:48.320 --> 00:29:53.277 but in this country people are like I know this should work I turned on TV and 00:29:53.360 --> 00:29:56.637 there was a someone I know or someone I've talked to at a conference said yeah 00:29:56.720 --> 00:30:00.957 okay good the the it is a little weird when they show up, the person showing up 00:30:01.040 --> 00:30:04.317 is going to be carp. That's not everyone's cup of tea. And someone who's 00:30:04.400 --> 00:30:07.277 like looks 00:30:07.360 --> 00:30:11.117 18 but is actually 25. And and it'll 00:30:11.200 --> 00:30:15.277 work. I mean, I think that's what's like going around the country. And that means 00:30:15.360 --> 00:30:18.077 both like from introduction to sale, 00:30:18.160 --> 00:30:20.797 it's quicker and as importantly from 00:30:20.880 --> 00:30:24.077 sale to actual output, we have a lot 00:30:24.160 --> 00:30:27.997 more authority. Like we used to basically get in these enterprises and I 00:30:28.080 --> 00:30:29.837 have to spend half my day explaining to 00:30:29.920 --> 00:30:32.637 people look I know the person down the 00:30:32.720 --> 00:30:37.677 hall is your tech person but they used to be a school teacher in music. This is 00:30:37.760 --> 00:30:40.957 actual real example. >> Okay. >> Yeah. And which you know I like the idea 00:30:41.040 --> 00:30:45.437 of a music but it's like and what they're saying about the tech stack you 00:30:45.520 --> 00:30:48.957 know and then and you could do five years or you could do at the prime I 00:30:49.040 --> 00:30:51.677 used to say five years versus 9 months. 00:30:51.760 --> 00:30:53.757 Now it's like five years versus three 00:30:53.840 --> 00:30:55.677 months. or two months. 00:30:55.760 --> 00:31:01.437 >> And there's actually much more of a please just tell us how to do this. Not 00:31:01.520 --> 00:31:04.557 always. >> Yeah. >> And I would say interestingly, our newer 00:31:04.640 --> 00:31:07.437 partners, customers are much more 00:31:07.520 --> 00:31:09.117 wanting to hear, okay, I know this 00:31:09.200 --> 00:31:11.757 works. It's gone from I'm not sure this 00:31:11.840 --> 00:31:14.717 is works, but my life is on the line in 00:31:14.800 --> 00:31:19.437 commercial and government like five years ago to I know this I've heard and 00:31:19.520 --> 00:31:22.957 know this will work. >> How do I do this optimally? Mhm. 00:31:23.040 --> 00:31:27.117 >> And then you know the bottlenecking we have currently means like you know I 00:31:27.200 --> 00:31:30.797 mean I tell I'm telling governments all over the world look we're not showing up 00:31:30.880 --> 00:31:33.917 to do a sales call for Maven. 00:31:34.000 --> 00:31:37.677 You know it works. We know it works. 00:31:37.760 --> 00:31:40.637 Show up in my office. Explain to how explain to us how you're going to make 00:31:40.720 --> 00:31:43.437 this easy for us because we don't have huge bandwidth. 00:31:43.520 --> 00:31:45.357 >> I mean I'm not talking about the US government. That's a completely 00:31:45.440 --> 00:31:48.797 different thing there. We will bend over backwards and do whatever it takes. But 00:31:48.880 --> 00:31:52.397 like allied countries in Europe was like yeah you know they're like oh we need 00:31:52.480 --> 00:31:56.317 five sales meetings and a PowerPoint we're like great I can recommend some 00:31:56.400 --> 00:31:58.477 other company it won't work but you'll 00:31:58.560 --> 00:32:03.677 get all the sales reps all that cycle all the forms everything you want and 00:32:03.760 --> 00:32:06.157 like you know I was just on the I was the other day talking to a very 00:32:06.240 --> 00:32:10.237 important European uh leader I was like look 00:32:10.320 --> 00:32:14.637 you have an intel service you have a military they should evaluate what works 00:32:14.720 --> 00:32:20.157 they're going to tell you this works nothing else really is you can buy you 00:32:20.240 --> 00:32:23.757 want the thing that doesn't work but sounds good they'll do lots of meetings 00:32:23.840 --> 00:32:27.517 with you we can't do them >> we just can't and in commercial it's not 00:32:27.600 --> 00:32:29.677 quite like that in the US but you know 00:32:29.760 --> 00:32:31.997 there's a sense that the demand is 00:32:32.080 --> 00:32:35.197 greater than what we can supply and you 00:32:35.280 --> 00:32:39.037 know and then we want and then we I was just we were just telling an older 00:32:39.120 --> 00:32:43.277 customer look the way you're doing it will not allow us to create value we're 00:32:43.360 --> 00:32:47.197 not a normal software company if you're not creating value how are we going 00:32:47.280 --> 00:32:49.757 going to get paid. >> Yeah. >> And by the way, you're going to want to 00:32:49.840 --> 00:32:53.037 get rid of us at some point. So the whole thing makes no sense. Like we're 00:32:53.120 --> 00:32:54.637 not selling you sake dinner. We're not 00:32:54.720 --> 00:32:57.037 selling you our charm. We're selling you 00:32:57.120 --> 00:33:00.317 significant value creation in a in 00:33:00.400 --> 00:33:04.237 ridiculously short times of period and value creation on top end and buying 00:33:04.320 --> 00:33:08.237 like basically you know and and then another thing by the way I tell people 00:33:08.320 --> 00:33:12.237 is you know all the time it's like look I get to have an opinion because of our 00:33:12.320 --> 00:33:15.597 financials. Do you want to have an opinion again? 00:33:15.680 --> 00:33:19.437 You got to have financials like this. A lot of people want to be able to have an 00:33:19.520 --> 00:33:21.437 opinion again in public. 00:33:21.520 --> 00:33:24.477 >> You have VC returns for retail investors 00:33:24.560 --> 00:33:26.877 and now you're having PE outcomes for 00:33:26.960 --> 00:33:30.637 large companies. What's next? 00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:33.437 >> Just being very very focused on the US 00:33:33.520 --> 00:33:38.077 growing the US growing the quality of the UX. There's a lot more interestingly 00:33:38.160 --> 00:33:41.037 when we're talking externally of course people want to know the financial 00:33:41.120 --> 00:33:44.077 metrics you know like these rule of 114 00:33:44.160 --> 00:33:45.757 the 70 all these things that are crazy 00:33:45.840 --> 00:33:51.197 valuable but internally it's like really back to the like how do we make sure 00:33:51.280 --> 00:33:54.957 this implementation is the best how do we make sure the product is is advancing 00:33:55.040 --> 00:33:58.557 how do we make sure we're building the products of tomorrow how are we in the 00:33:58.640 --> 00:34:03.037 US government closest to the the the things that will give America a 00:34:03.120 --> 00:34:06.397 strategic advantage just not just now but for decades 00:34:06.480 --> 00:34:09.437 Uh, how do we on the commercial side? 00:34:09.520 --> 00:34:13.277 How do we make sure that the um Oh, it's just palenteer. People are roving 00:34:13.360 --> 00:34:17.677 around. No hierarchy. This is just this the Palunteer thing. They're like, "What 00:34:17.760 --> 00:34:21.917 are you doing here? Get out. I'm working. I have no time. CEO, move out 00:34:22.000 --> 00:34:24.477 of the way." Yeah. This the other thing 00:34:24.560 --> 00:34:27.037 of Palunteer. You know, we have we value 00:34:27.120 --> 00:34:29.757 our work. Like he can have any opinion 00:34:29.840 --> 00:34:34.397 he wants. He can come in here and like do it. So, you you you get to you 00:34:34.480 --> 00:34:36.717 perform here. You get to be you, not just me. 00:34:36.800 --> 00:34:40.637 >> Um, you know, this concept of worker available GDP. 00:34:40.720 --> 00:34:42.717 >> Yeah. >> You know, you're going to participate in 00:34:42.800 --> 00:34:45.917 the AI revolution. He's going to participate in the AI revolution. We're 00:34:46.000 --> 00:34:51.037 building it here. >> The the person on the factory floor right now, 00:34:51.120 --> 00:34:53.357 >> okay, >> wonders, are we going to get rich and 00:34:53.440 --> 00:34:57.677 are they going to get poor? And is that we that that will not work for our 00:34:57.760 --> 00:35:01.197 society. >> Yeah. No. So, what's Palanteer's role in 00:35:01.280 --> 00:35:06.317 re-industrialization? making sure worker workers I mean first 00:35:06.400 --> 00:35:08.637 of all there's like how do you manufacture at scale how do you 00:35:08.720 --> 00:35:12.477 manufacture in addition this way how do you bring how do you if you bring let's 00:35:12.560 --> 00:35:15.517 say you bring um Japanese Taiwanese 00:35:15.600 --> 00:35:20.077 Korean uh manufacturing to America the interesting thing people always think 00:35:20.160 --> 00:35:24.157 manufacturing is manufacturing you actually have to manufacture their 00:35:24.240 --> 00:35:26.317 building the way you would do it in 00:35:26.400 --> 00:35:31.517 those countries because that's how then you have to scale American workers so 00:35:31.600 --> 00:35:35.517 like for example we have American workers working at factories like 00:35:35.600 --> 00:35:38.077 Japanese factories especially and like 00:35:38.160 --> 00:35:40.397 they're American workers they're not 00:35:40.480 --> 00:35:43.437 Japanese workers but we can get we can 00:35:43.520 --> 00:35:48.397 use foundry ontology to bring out the advantages of American worker and give 00:35:48.480 --> 00:35:51.677 them the capacity to roughly work like a Japanese engineer 00:35:51.760 --> 00:35:55.997 >> and so like and and honestly at this point we're really just showing rather 00:35:56.080 --> 00:35:59.677 than telling because you really have to show people the narrative working and 00:35:59.760 --> 00:36:01.517 now in the US military that's going gang 00:36:01.600 --> 00:36:03.997 busters because most of the people who 00:36:04.080 --> 00:36:06.877 actually do the work are domain 00:36:06.960 --> 00:36:09.997 expertise specific individuals 00:36:10.080 --> 00:36:13.197 and they're seeing oh wow I can like 00:36:13.280 --> 00:36:15.917 like in special operations 00:36:16.000 --> 00:36:18.397 >> as an example people using our product 00:36:18.480 --> 00:36:20.877 are using our product yeah it's not like 00:36:20.960 --> 00:36:24.237 there's not the like highly elite uh 00:36:24.320 --> 00:36:28.477 Yale grad I think he actually is a Yale grad something like that 00:36:28.560 --> 00:36:33.197 >> yeah something here we have like even more elite Like we have the person 00:36:33.280 --> 00:36:36.797 creating the real value is someone who joined the military and they are just 00:36:36.880 --> 00:36:39.917 crushing it. >> We have some fun questions. 00:36:40.000 --> 00:36:41.917 >> Okay. Great. >> Okay. I saved some fun ones. 00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:45.037 >> Okay. >> So, there was a heartwarming part in this book. 00:36:45.120 --> 00:36:50.797 >> Yeah. >> I wasn't expecting it. Um there was a point in time in 00:36:50.880 --> 00:36:51.997 >> Not my social life. 00:36:52.080 --> 00:36:55.437 >> No. Well, your family life. 00:36:55.520 --> 00:36:58.317 >> So, can you tell me about Rosita? 00:36:58.400 --> 00:37:02.237 >> Yeah. Um so uh when my parents there's a 00:37:02.320 --> 00:37:05.357 phase where my parents it was like the 00:37:05.440 --> 00:37:09.917 the the thing is when you are outside the norm and in a family there's a 00:37:10.000 --> 00:37:11.517 warmth in the family. >> Yeah. 00:37:11.600 --> 00:37:15.677 >> So it's like like if you're like our family like total freak show in all 00:37:15.760 --> 00:37:19.597 variables. So the outside is kind of like the freak show. I'm sure when my 00:37:19.680 --> 00:37:23.917 parents came over people had to be warned kind of thing. [laughter] Uh and 00:37:24.000 --> 00:37:28.317 like you know you may not be okay with this setup. And then but on the inside 00:37:28.400 --> 00:37:30.717 because of that it was an exceedingly 00:37:30.800 --> 00:37:34.237 intellectual vibrant warm environment. 00:37:34.320 --> 00:37:37.357 And then when we we when I was a little 00:37:37.440 --> 00:37:42.557 kid and we had moved we had moved from New York uh an incredible city which is 00:37:42.640 --> 00:37:46.077 largely was about to get the most horrifically in all likelihood 00:37:46.160 --> 00:37:49.037 ridiculous mayor. Um uh more than you 00:37:49.120 --> 00:37:51.677 want to hear from me. Um my parents 00:37:51.760 --> 00:37:56.317 decided to get a dog. Obviously we wanted it. So if you're like in my 00:37:56.400 --> 00:37:58.557 family background, of course, the only place you're going to get a dog is in 00:37:58.640 --> 00:38:02.557 the pound because that, you know, you wouldn't get a fancy and a dog of 00:38:02.640 --> 00:38:06.397 course, you know. So we went there and we went and then we come to the pound 00:38:06.480 --> 00:38:10.397 and the I even like in my mind's eye remembering it, but it might just be 00:38:10.480 --> 00:38:14.237 I've heard the story a thousand times, but you know, uh and then there's this 00:38:14.320 --> 00:38:19.517 dog that is and the person screaming, I hate this dog. I hate this dog. Uh and 00:38:19.600 --> 00:38:22.877 then my mom said, well, why do you hate the dog? And it's like because the dog 00:38:22.960 --> 00:38:25.837 there's a lock that you know a human could understand but a dog shouldn't be 00:38:25.920 --> 00:38:27.597 able to. And Rosita was breaking out of 00:38:27.680 --> 00:38:33.117 the lock. And then Rosita that's not why she they the like the warden in you know 00:38:33.200 --> 00:38:35.517 it's basically a warden of death because they're like they were going to put her 00:38:35.600 --> 00:38:39.117 to sleep the next day. >> And uh the ward's like I can't wait till 00:38:39.200 --> 00:38:42.557 tomorrow. We're going to put they became Rosita to sleep. And my mom's like well 00:38:42.640 --> 00:38:45.037 why do you hate the other? She's like well he's breaking out all the time. 00:38:45.120 --> 00:38:48.797 She's breaking out all the time. M said well okay that's one thing. And even 00:38:48.880 --> 00:38:51.677 worse than that, Rosita would go back and break open the other locks for other 00:38:51.760 --> 00:38:56.317 people. >> Yeah. [laughter] And then my mom was like, "That's our dog." 00:38:56.400 --> 00:38:58.317 >> And >> And then Yeah. And so that's And then 00:38:58.400 --> 00:39:03.357 Rosita played a a tremendous role in our life. It was more like she's very very 00:39:03.440 --> 00:39:05.197 high IQ. Like it was honestly more like 00:39:05.280 --> 00:39:10.397 a human like than a dog. >> And uh Yeah. And uh yeah, 00:39:10.480 --> 00:39:14.637 >> that's Rosita. >> And later on you exumed Rosita's room. 00:39:14.720 --> 00:39:17.197 >> Yeah. There's a lot in the book I probably wouldn't have told, but like 00:39:17.280 --> 00:39:20.477 Yeah. So one of the crazy things about 00:39:20.560 --> 00:39:24.557 having resources is you can do things that mean a lot to you that you know. So 00:39:24.640 --> 00:39:28.397 I through all sorts of ways got in touch with the person who bought the house 00:39:28.480 --> 00:39:30.717 that was force sold during the divorce. 00:39:30.800 --> 00:39:33.997 Uh and person was very generous and for 00:39:34.080 --> 00:39:36.557 lots of reasons agreed to have me exume 00:39:36.640 --> 00:39:40.157 their whole yard. And then I took uh 00:39:40.240 --> 00:39:43.597 Rosita and now I'm uh yeah I have her a 00:39:43.680 --> 00:39:47.997 burial site near my house. >> That's really sweet. Rosita was the best. 00:39:48.080 --> 00:39:52.317 >> Really? >> No. >> Okay. Well, if you were a cupcake, what 00:39:52.400 --> 00:39:54.637 kind of cupcake would you be? >> I don't want to be a cupcake cuz I don't 00:39:54.720 --> 00:39:58.077 want to get eaten. I'm resisting becoming a cupcake. But 00:39:58.160 --> 00:39:59.117 >> what's your favorite cupcake? 00:39:59.200 --> 00:40:01.037 >> Apparently in No, I actually don't eat 00:40:01.120 --> 00:40:06.237 them that, but I actually recently in DC there's these very fancy I just It all 00:40:06.320 --> 00:40:08.557 comes down to the icing. >> It's just the icing. 00:40:08.640 --> 00:40:10.157 >> I don't know why people eat the cupcake. 00:40:10.240 --> 00:40:12.557 It's just the icing. >> Makes no sense. Yeah, it makes no sense. 00:40:12.640 --> 00:40:15.677 Why even have it there? >> Well, no, you have it. There's like a I 00:40:15.760 --> 00:40:19.757 don't know the same way you have. Well, yeah. You have like a vehicle for for 00:40:19.840 --> 00:40:23.117 the coffee. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, it comes down like there's really I 00:40:23.200 --> 00:40:27.357 mean a lot of places have good cupcakes, but very few people have great cupcakes. 00:40:27.440 --> 00:40:31.357 >> Okay. Well, before we head too far back into the office, thank you so much, Alex. 00:40:31.440 --> 00:40:33.917 >> Thank you. Very nice. Very nice to meet you. 00:40:34.000 --> 00:40:37.277 >> Hey, it's Molly. If you enjoy our interviews, check out our newsletter, 00:40:37.360 --> 00:40:41.787 sorcery.bc, BC where we deliver a once a week top deals and tech headlines 00:40:41.870 --> 00:40:46.367 [music] email and also go deeper on our podcast interviews. 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