WEBVTT

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>> WELCOME BACK TO SQUAWK BOX.

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PALANTIR EXPANDING ITS PARTNERSHIP WITH
NVIDIA TO BUILD CUSTOM AI SYSTEMS FOR THE

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U.S. GOVERNMENT. THAT STOCK
SHOOTING UP. IT'S UP AGAIN THIS

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MORNING UP ALMOST 6% THIS WEEK.

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AND JOINING US RIGHT NOW
EXCLUSIVELY AT THE TABLE, ALEX

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KARP, PALANTIR'S CO-FOUNDER AND CEO.
AND CNBC'S SEEMA MODY, WHO

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COVERS PALANTIR, JOINS US.
AND TELL US ABOUT TELL US ABOUT THE

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DEAL WITH. THERE'S SO MANY
THINGS I THINK WE ALL WANT TO

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TALK ABOUT, BUT BUT LET'S
GET TO THE NVIDIA DEAL FIRST.

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>> BECAUSE I HAVE SO MUCH
RESPECT FOR NVIDIA AND JENSEN

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HUANG. I'M GOING TO TRY TO KEEP
THIS MORE ADULT THAN I USUALLY

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DO. BUT THE TRUTH IS,
IF YOU WANT TO KNOW HOW THIS CAME

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TOGETHER, FROM MY PERSPECTIVE,
IT WAS IT WAS THERE ARE A LOT

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OF TECHNICAL ISSUES. WHO CONTROLS
THE MODELS, WHO CONTROLS THE WEIGHTS? WHO

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CONTROLS THE VALUE OF YOUR BUSINESS?
BUT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE,

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WE'RE, WE'RE SITTING
ON CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE ACROSS

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AMERICA, UKRAINE, ISRAEL,
EVERYONE WHO USES LLMS ON THE

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BATTLEFIELD RUNS ON TOP OF OUR

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ONTOLOGY. AND OUR CLIENTS ARE
JUST TO SAY THEY'RE UNHAPPY

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WITH THE FRONTIER LABS IS TO SAY, I'M
WELCOME AT THE BERKELEY FACULTY. IT'S LIKE

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THERE'S JUST A LEVEL
OF DISCOMFORT AND LOSS OF TRUST

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THAT ALSO MADE IT. IT REALLY, REALLY.

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>> UNPACK THAT. WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT?

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>> WELL, YOU HAVE OKAY.
SO WHEN YOU'RE WHEN YOU'RE USING LARGE

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LANGUAGE MODELS, THEY ARE.
IT'S LIKE A. AT THIS POINT, EVERYONE

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TECHNICAL REALIZES THEY'RE
LIKE A CRITICAL RESOURCE TO MAKE

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THEM VALUABLE IN AN ENTERPRISE
LIKE BATTLEFIELD CONTEXT OR

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REGULATED CONTEXT OR MANUFACTURING, YOU
HAVE TO HAVE WHAT'S CALLED AN APPLICATION

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LAYER. AND WE, WE HAVE THIS
THING CALLED ONTOLOGY THAT NOW

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EVERYONE'S COPYING, BUT DE FACTO, IT
TAKES A LARGE LANGUAGE MODEL. IT MAKES IT

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SAFE AND USEFUL AND PRECISE.
SO SAFE BECAUSE IT DOESN'T TOUCH

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YOUR UNDERLYING DATA,
SAFE BECAUSE IT PREVENTS THE LARGE

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LANGUAGE MODEL FROM CACHING
YOUR DATA AND REPLICATING YOUR

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BUSINESS SAFE BECAUSE IT
DOESN'T TRANSFER YOUR IP OF HOW

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TO FIGHT SECRET DATA,
TOP SECRET DATA, OR IN A CLINICAL

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CONTEXT. SO THE GENERAL WAY
THESE THINGS WERE SOLD, AND

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AGAIN, THESE PEOPLE ARE SAM AND,
AND DARIO, THERE'S NOTHING MORE

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FUN THAN DEBATING DARIO IN PRIVATE.
SO THIS IS I'M NOT

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THROWING SHADE AT THEM.
BUT SOMETHING HAS GONE COMPLETELY

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WRONG. AND THE BASIC VIEW AMONG

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ENTERPRISES IN THIS COUNTRY
IS I'M GOING TO CHILL LAX AND

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WASTE MY TIME WITH TOKENS.
I'M GOING TO GET NO VALUE AND

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THEY'RE GOING TO GET MY IP.
>> NOW THAT SOUNDS LIKE SHADE.

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OKAY. AND NOT TO SHADE.
IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU'RE SAYING THESE.

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>> NO, NO NO, NO, THIS IS REPORTING.

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>> OKAY. >> AND THIS IS REPORTING
THAT I'VE, I'VE LITERALLY AGAINST MY

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OWN INTEREST CALLED THESE ARE
LIKE, I'M PROFITING FROM THIS,

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RIGHT? SO THE REALITY IS YOU
MAY NOT LIKE US AT MY FORMER

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SCHOOL, HAVERFORD OR BERKELEY,
BUT ENTERPRISES IN THIS COUNTRY

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TRUST AND LOVE US, ESPECIALLY
ONES THAT ARE INVOLVED IN

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CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE,
BOTH PUBLIC AND PRIVATE. OKAY, SO I

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WANT FOR THOSE COUNTRIES,
WE'RE COMING UP TO JULY 4TH. I WANT

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THOSE I WANT FOR US AND OUR,
OUR, OUR, OUR, OUR, OUR FRIENDS

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ACROSS THE GLOBE TO HAVE
THE VERY BEST TECH RESOURCES. IN

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FACT, THE WHOLE SECRET OF PALANTIR IS
THE FORWARD DEPLOYED MODEL, THE PRODUCTS

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THAT HAVE BEEN FIVE YEARS AHEAD.

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YOU KNOW, YOU'VE BEEN WITH ME
FOR A LONG TIME. EVERYONE,

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EVERYONE, EVERYONE SAID PHDS
WERE SERVICES. THEY SAID, WE

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DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT AN ONTOLOGY IS.
THAT'S THE ONLY

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THING PEOPLE TALK ABOUT. NOW.
THE SECRET WAS WE DELIVERED THE

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BEST THINGS FOR THE WARFIGHTERS.

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THOSE WARFIGHTERS HAVE SERIOUS
TRUST ISSUES, BUT IT'S NOT JUST

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THE WAR VIS A VIS FRONTIER LABS.

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THEN YOU HAVE MY ENTERPRISES
IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR WHO HAVE THE

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SAME ISSUES, LIKE WHY WOULD
THEY GET ACCESS TO MY DATA IF

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THEY'RE GOING TO BUILD MY ALPHA?

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WHY WOULDN'T I CONTROL THE WEIGHTS? WHY
WOULDN'T? AND THAT'S WHERE YOU GET THIS

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PARTNERSHIP. WHAT ALIGNS ME

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WITH NVIDIA AND I THINK IS WHAT

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THE TECHNICAL CUSTOMERS WANT,

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WHICH IS CONTROL OVER THEIR

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COMPUTE, THEIR MODELS, THEIR

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DATA STACK AND THEIR ALPHA.
THEY WANT TO KNOW THEY OWN THE

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MEANS OF PRODUCTION.
IT'S NOT BEING TRANSFERRED TO SOMEONE

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ELSE. THEY'RE NOT INTERESTED
IN SOME FAKE DEPLOY CODE THAT

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SOMEHOW IS DEPLOYING TOKENS,
THAT TRANSFERS THE ALPHA TO A

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THIRD PARTY AND THE JIG IS UP.

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AND SO WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT
A WAY BOTH, BOTH OUR OUR PRODUCTS

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ARE AGNOSTIC. WE, WE NOW SELL
A PRODUCT TO CUSTOMERS THAT

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ALLOWS YOU TO SWITCH FROM MODEL
TO MODEL BECAUSE. AND WE'RE

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COMPLETELY AGNOSTIC, BUT WE
NEED TO REBUILD TRUST. AND THAT

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TRUST IS GOING TO HAPPEN WHERE
EVERYONE GETS TO ASK, ASK AND

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ANSWER BASIC QUESTIONS.
WHO OWNS THE DATA? WHERE IS IT

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CACHED? ARE THE PROMPTS SECURE?

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IS THIS BEING TRANSFERRED TO YOU?
ARE YOU BEING OKAY? IF IT

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WAS SO VALUABLE, LET'S SAY I CAN MAKE YOU
$1 BILLION TOMORROW. WOULDN'T I SAY I'LL

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MAKE YOU $1 BILLION AND I WANT 30%.
WHY ARE THEY CHARGING FOR

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TOKENS IF IT'S SO VALUABLE?
>> SO THEN, ALEX, IF THE KEY,

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FROM WHAT I'M HEARING YOU SAY,
IS A SECURE, AMERICAN BORN OPEN

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SOURCE MODEL, HOW QUICKLY CAN
YOUR MODEL COMPETE WITH THE FRONTIER?

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>> WELL, KNOW WHAT.
>> I'M SAYING IS. AND AGENTIC AI.

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>> OKAY, WHAT I'M CLAIMING,
OBVIOUSLY SLIGHTLY TRUE, BUT

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SLIGHTLY SELF-CENTERED IS IT'S

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THE MODEL PLUS AN APPLICATION
LAYER PLUS COMPUTE. IT IS

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REALLY ALL THREE.
SO IN OUR JARGON, IT'S THE VALUE, THE

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REASON. OKAY, JUST LOOK
AT OUR FINANCIALS. THE REASON WHY

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EVERYONE IS CHILLAXING WITH BAD
FINANCIALS AND GROWTH WITH

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LOSING MONEY IS THE CLIENT
REFUSES TO PAY THE TRUE COST.

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THE TWO PLACES THAT ACTUALLY
MAKE MONEY, LIKE PROFIT FREE

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CASH FLOW ARE OUR APPLICATION
LAYER CALLED ONTOLOGY AND

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COMPUTE. OKAY, WHAT?
I AM NOT JUST CLAIMING WE CAN TAKE AN

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OPEN MODEL AND IN THE
CLASSIFIED OR NON-CLASSIFIED

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CONTEXT, GET IT TO THE POINT
OF A FRONTIER MODEL, BUT A YOU

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CONTROL THE WEIGHTS.
SO WHAT IS THE TRUE COST? NOT JUST WHAT

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YOU'RE PAYING. THE TRUE COST
IS NOT JUST IS WHAT YOU MAKE MINUS

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WHAT YOU LOSE, MEANING THE VALUE
OF YOUR BUSINESS. BUT WE

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CAN GET THE THE FRONTIER
APPLICATION TO BE EXACTLY THE

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SAME AS A FRONTIER MODEL, WITHOUT
THE RISK OF TRANSFERRING THE ALPHA OF YOUR

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BUSINESS TO ANOTHER.
BY THE WAY, YOU COULD DO THIS WITH A

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FRONTIER CLOSED MODEL TOO,
BUT THEN THE CLIENTS HAVE TO BE

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ABLE TO ASK AND ANSWER A VERY
BASIC QUESTIONS. ARE YOU

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KEEPING THE DATA? ARE YOU GOING
TO ENTER OUR BUSINESS? WHAT DO

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YOU IN THE CLASSIFIED CONTEXT,
WHEN THE DEPARTMENT OF WAR GOES

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TO YOU AND SAYS, I NEED
THIS APPLICATION, DO THEY GET TO

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CONTROL THE WEIGHTS TO DO IT,
OR DO YOU GET TO CONTROL THE

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WEIGHTS? ARE WE REALLY GOING
TO OUTSOURCE THE BATTLEFIELD OF

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THIS COUNTRY TO THE CONSENSUS
VIEW IN SILICON VALLEY? THAT IS

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EFFING INSANE. AND BY THE WAY,
EVERY SINGLE ENTERPRISE IN THIS

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COUNTRY IN PRIVATE, A LOT
OF THEM DON'T WANT TO SPEAK IN

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PUBLIC BECAUSE IT GETS IT GETS OUTSOURCED
TO THE NEURODIVERGENT, CRAZY PERSON

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THAT APPARENTLY IS ON DRUGS.
THE ONE THING I DON'T DO IT.

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OKAY, SO THAT'S MY ROLE.
BUT I'M TELLING YOU, IN THIS

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COUNTRY, AT EVERY SINGLE
ENTERPRISE I DEAL WITH, THESE

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PEOPLE ARE LIVID. THEY'RE LIKE,
I AM PAYING FOR TOKENS THAT

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CREATE NO VALUE. THESE PEOPLE ARE STEALING
THE WEIGHTS IN ALPHA OF MY BUSINESS, AND

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THEY'RE CREATING A WEALTH TAX
THAT DOES NOT HELP THE POOR. IT

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JUST PUNISHES.
STARTS WITH THE BILLIONAIRES. EVERY SINGLE

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PERSON AT THIS TABLE IS GOING
TO BE PAYING A WEALTH TAX ONLY

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TO PUNISH US. AND THE REASON
FOR IT IS BECAUSE THESE MODELS

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HAVE BEEN COMPLETELY OVER,
IRRESPONSIBLY OVERSOLD. AND THE

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SALE IS IT'S DANGEROUS
FOR EVERYONE, WHICH IS WHY I CAN

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GIVE IT TO ALL YOUR ADVERSARIES,
BUT I CAN'T GIVE IT TO THE

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DEPARTMENT OF WAR OR I CAN'T
SAFELY GIVE IT TO AN ENTERPRISE

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IN THIS COUNTRY WITHOUT BEING
CERTAIN THAT THE ALPHA OF THAT

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BUSINESS COULD TRANSFER TO THIS MODEL
TOMORROW. I HAVE NO BUSINESS. NO JOB.

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>> YOU SOUND PRETTY ANGRY.
>> NO, THE. THIS IS THE VOICE

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OF AMERICAN BUSINESS THAT IS
BEING CHANNELED THROUGH ME. AND

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I'M TELLING YOU, IT IS.
IT IS ABSOLUTELY A PROBLEM FOR THIS

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COUNTRY, BECAUSE WE ARE ON THE
CUTTING EDGE OF EVERY SINGLE AI

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TECHNOLOGY. BUT IF YOU'RE GOING
TO TRIPOLI, OVERSELL SOMETHING.

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AND AND BY THE WAY, THE ENTERPRISES ARE
JUST TIRED OF IT. BUT BY THE WAY, JUST A

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MINUTE. I WANT YOU, EVERYBODY
WATCHING THIS TO TEST WHAT I'M

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SAYING, ESPECIALLY INVESTORS
WHO THINK SOMEHOW THIS IS

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WORKING, PICK UP THE PHONE
AND CALL A CEO IN PRIVATE, NOT IN

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PUBLIC. EVERY SINGLE PERSON
HERE CAN DO THIS. CALL 2 OR 3

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AND SAY, MADMAN KARP IS ON TV
SAYING, WE'RE LIVID. I'M NOT

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GOING TO QUOTE YOU. YOU KNOW,
I WON'T QUOTE YOU. YOU HAVE A

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HISTORY. AND SEE, THEY'RE
TWICE AS LIVID AS ME. LIKE.

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>> SO IF YOU'RE RIGHT, THOUGH,
DOES THAT MEAN THAT WE ARE

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LIVING IN SOME KIND OF TERRIBLE
AI BUBBLE AND THAT WE'RE GOING

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TO, IN A QUARTER OR 2 OR 3
QUARTERS FROM NOW, WE'RE GOING

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TO HEAR THAT BIG ENTERPRISES ARE CANCELING
THEIR SUBSCRIPTIONS TO THESE PRODUCTS,

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OR THAT THEY BUILD OUT
IS GOING TO SLOW BECAUSE.

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>> THIS IS THIS IS THE TRAGEDY

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OF IT. THE REALITY OF COMPUTE

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PLUS ONTOLOGY PLUS MODEL CHANGE

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IS CHANGING THE COURSE OF HISTORY.
ASK THE UKRAINIANS,

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ASK THE ISRAELIS, ASK OUR DEPARTMENT OF
WAR. ASK THE ENTERPRISES THAT ARE WORKING.

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WE DO NOT HAVE TO OVERSELL WHAT
WE HAVE. WE HAVE. AND IT'S ALL

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BEING BUILT IN THIS COUNTRY,
BASICALLY, EXCEPT FOR THE OPEN

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MODELS, WHICH IS A REAL THING
COMING FROM CHINA, EXCEPT FOR

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NVIDIA OPEN MODELS, WHICH ARE
WORLD CLASS. BASICALLY, IT'S

00:09:13.820 --> 00:09:16.737
ALL BEING BUILT HERE.
WE DO NOT HAVE TO OVERHYPE. WE DO NOT

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HAVE TO OVERHYPE IT TO THE POINT
WHERE WE'RE GOING TO HAVE

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WEALTH TAX, PUNISHING THE WEALTH.

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>> IF THEY'RE CHARGING
THE ENTERPRISE THREE TIMES AS MUCH

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AS THEY SHOULD BE. YEAH.
AND THEN AND THEN THEY HAVE TO PULL

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BACK ON THAT. THAT CHANGES
THE MATH OF ALL OF THIS.

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>> WHO'S THE THEY. >> LIKE THE LARGE
LANGUAGE MODELS, WHICH BY THE WAY,

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IMPACTS YOUR PARTNER NVIDIA BECAUSE.

00:09:34.440 --> 00:09:37.397
>> THEY SORRY, I'M TALKING
ABOUT THE THEY, THE ENTERPRISES

00:09:37.480 --> 00:09:40.267
THAT POWER THIS COUNTRY
AS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING YOU'RE

00:09:40.350 --> 00:09:43.897
TALKING ABOUT. THE THEY
AS FRONTIER LABS IN SILICON VALLEY.

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THAT'S GREAT. I'M FOCUSED
ON THE ENTERPRISES OF THIS.

00:09:47.250 --> 00:09:51.337
>> COUNTRY, HYPERSCALERS. >> WELL, YOU
KNOW, IT IT DEPENDS WHAT THEY'RE SELLING.

00:09:51.420 --> 00:09:54.407
THAT'S VERY, VERY DOWNSTREAM
FROM US. WE'RE COMPLETELY

00:09:54.490 --> 00:09:58.717
AGNOSTIC. WE PREFER A WORLD WHERE THERE
ARE MORE HYPERSCALERS, WHERE THERE'S ALL

00:09:58.800 --> 00:10:02.517
SORTS OF NEW HYPERSCALERS. ELON,
NVIDIA, WE LIKE THAT WORLD. WHY

00:10:02.600 --> 00:10:06.057
DO WE LIKE THE WORLD?
THE SAME REASON WHEN YOU GO ONLINE AND

00:10:06.140 --> 00:10:08.287
THERE'S, YOU KNOW, THERE'S 50
KINDS OF KINDS OF COATS. YOU

00:10:08.370 --> 00:10:12.057
GET TO PICK THE ONE YOU LIKE.
BUT WHAT IS HAPPENING AMONG THE

00:10:12.140 --> 00:10:16.737
MOST TECHNICAL PLAYERS IS THEY'RE SAYING,
I WANT SOMETHING I OWN. THIS IS MY

00:10:16.820 --> 00:10:19.967
BUSINESS. I WANT TO OWN THE GPUS.
I WANT TO OWN MY DATA. I

00:10:20.050 --> 00:10:22.937
WANT TO OWN THE MODEL.
I WANT TO CONTROL THE ALPHA.

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>> SO IS THAT CREATING MORE
MORE OPPORTUNITY FOR. ARE YOU

00:10:26.020 --> 00:10:28.877
ALREADY SEEING THE GOVERNMENT
CANCEL CONTRACTS WITH ANTHROPIC

00:10:28.960 --> 00:10:31.817
AND OPENAI AND SAYING, WE.
>> WANT TO WORK. WE'RE NOT HERE.

00:10:31.900 --> 00:10:35.047
>> LITERALLY NOT HERE TO TALK
ABOUT WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN TO

00:10:35.130 --> 00:10:37.817
A VERY IMPORTANT BUSINESS
IN THE COUNTRY, EXCEPT FOR,

00:10:37.900 --> 00:10:39.527
OBVIOUSLY, TO SOME EXTENT, MINE.

00:10:39.610 --> 00:10:44.027
IN MY BUSINESS, WE HAVE MUCH
MORE DEMAND THAN WE CAN SUPPLY.

00:10:44.110 --> 00:10:48.627
THAT'S LIKE AND AND BY THE WAY,
IT MAY BE SOMEWHAT MAYBE, MAYBE

00:10:48.710 --> 00:10:51.137
THE CRAZY PERSON THAT STILL
ONLY CARES ABOUT FREE CASH FLOW,

00:10:51.220 --> 00:10:55.137
BUT WE HAVE MORE BUSINESS THAN
WE CAN SUPPLY. AND WE HAVE LOOK,

00:10:55.220 --> 00:10:56.907
IF YOU JUST LOOK AT OUR

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FINANCIALS, YOU CAN SEE LIKE
A TWO YEARS OUT, YOU CAN SEE 15,

00:11:02.490 --> 00:11:03.617
$18 BILLION IN FREE CASH FLOW.

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>> SORRY, LIKE FRUSTRATED BY THE
STOCK'S PERFORMANCE OVER THE LAST.

00:11:06.600 --> 00:11:09.617
>> YOU KNOW WHAT? I'VE BEEN
AT THIS FOR 20 YEARS. WE'VE BEEN

00:11:09.700 --> 00:11:12.417
AT THIS TALKING THIS WHEN WE
FIRST STARTED TALKING, PEOPLE

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WERE LIKE, IS THIS A SERVICES
COMPANY? IS IT WORTHLESS? YEAH.

00:11:16.440 --> 00:11:20.367
THE MARKETS ARE SHORT TERM,
VERY FICKLE. AND ALSO, QUITE

00:11:20.450 --> 00:11:23.937
FRANKLY, WHERE I WOULD THROW
SOME SHADE, WHAT INVESTORS

00:11:24.020 --> 00:11:27.637
ACTUALLY UNDERSTAND TECH,
THEY THINK BECAUSE THEY'RE VERY HIGH

00:11:27.720 --> 00:11:30.137
IQ AND THEY UNDERSTAND CERTAIN
THINGS, THEY UNDERSTAND WHAT

00:11:30.220 --> 00:11:33.207
THEY'RE USING. BASICALLY
THE FAULT OF INVESTORS IS TYPICALLY

00:11:33.290 --> 00:11:36.977
I USE IT, THEREFORE IT'S VALUABLE.
YEAH. WHAT AN ENTERPRISE USES. IT'S DOING

00:11:37.060 --> 00:11:40.617
COMPLICATED MANUFACTURING
OR PHARMACOLOGICAL RESEARCH OR

00:11:40.700 --> 00:11:43.787
PUTTING A BOMB ON OR BRINGING
SPECIAL FORCES PEOPLE HOME

00:11:43.870 --> 00:11:45.857
SAFELY. VERY DIFFERENT
THAN WHAT YOU'RE USING.

00:11:45.940 --> 00:11:49.827
>> IF YOU'RE A PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANY OR
YOU'RE THE GOVERNMENT, SHOULD YOU NOT BE

00:11:49.910 --> 00:11:54.597
THEREFORE USING ANTHROPIC
OR IT'S AN OPEN AI WITHOUT YOUR

00:11:54.680 --> 00:11:58.167
LAYER ON TOP? I MEAN, IS THAT WOULD
YOU SAY THAT'S DANGEROUS FOR THEM?

00:11:58.250 --> 00:12:01.137
>> YOU YOU LOOK, FIRST OF ALL,
HONESTLY, THE ONE THING THAT I

00:12:01.220 --> 00:12:04.707
AM SLIGHTLY FRUSTRATED ABOUT
THESE THESE WHEN, WHEN, WHEN,

00:12:04.790 --> 00:12:10.077
WHEN OPENAI OR ANTHROPIC ESPECIALLY ARE
TALKING ABOUT CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE, IT

00:12:10.160 --> 00:12:13.947
ONLY IS BEING USED IN OUR PRODUCT,
MY PRODUCT. AND THERE'S A REASON FOR THAT.

00:12:14.030 --> 00:12:15.717
THESE THINGS ARE VERY, VERY

00:12:15.800 --> 00:12:21.527
VALUABLE. WHAT, WHAT WHAT THEY
HAVE DONE. BUILDING MODELS IS

00:12:21.610 --> 00:12:24.197
WORLD HISTORIC. AND JUST SO
YOU SEE, I'M NOT THROWING SHADE.

00:12:24.280 --> 00:12:28.797
DARIO IS A LITERALLY HISTORIC
FIGURE. AND HE HE CAME FROM

00:12:28.880 --> 00:12:30.967
BEHIND AND HE'S NOW NUMBER ONE.

00:12:31.050 --> 00:12:33.967
ALMOST NO ONE IN THE I'VE BEEN
IN BUSINESS. WHATEVER YOU WANT

00:12:34.050 --> 00:12:35.967
TO CALL, I DO FOR A LONG TIME.

00:12:36.050 --> 00:12:38.237
I'VE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THIS.
OKAY. SO THE REALITY IS

00:12:38.320 --> 00:12:41.047
CRITICAL INFRASTRUCTURE DOES
NOT RUN THESE MODELS WITHOUT AN

00:12:41.130 --> 00:12:45.717
APPLICATION LAYER IN ALMOST ALL CASES. AND
MAYBE IT WON'T BE ALL CASES SOMEDAY THAT

00:12:45.800 --> 00:12:47.347
APPLICATION LAYERS ARE ONTOLOGY.

00:12:47.430 --> 00:12:50.347
THAT'S A FACT. AND THERE'S
A REASON FOR IT. IT'S NOT THAT,

00:12:50.430 --> 00:12:52.617
AS YOU KNOW, SOME PEOPLE
LOVE ME, SOME PEOPLE HATE ME.

00:12:52.700 --> 00:12:55.457
THEY'RE NOT BUYING.
THEY'RE NOT BUYING IT BECAUSE OF THAT.

00:12:55.540 --> 00:12:57.597
THEY'RE BUYING BECAUSE THESE
THINGS HAVE TO BE MADE SAFE.

00:12:57.680 --> 00:13:02.367
AND THE I, I'M GOING TO TRUST YOU. YOU
SHOULD TRUST ME BECAUSE I'VE NEVER LIED BS

00:13:02.450 --> 00:13:07.337
THING THAT JUST DOESN'T CUT IT AT THIS
LEVEL. AND, AND ENTERPRISES ARE RUN BY THE

00:13:07.420 --> 00:13:11.207
SHREWDEST AMERICAN ENTERPRISES
ARE RUN BY THE SHREWDEST, MOST

00:13:11.290 --> 00:13:14.647
WILY, INTELLIGENT PEOPLE ON THE PLANET.
IF YOU THINK THEY'RE

00:13:14.730 --> 00:13:18.417
GOING FOR THAT, YOU CAN GO TRY
TO SELL ME LIKE MY. MY PARENTS

00:13:18.500 --> 00:13:21.647
STILL WANT ME TO GET A JOB
AS A FACULTY MEMBER AT BERKELEY. GO

00:13:21.730 --> 00:13:23.657
TRY TO GET ME A JOB AT BERKELEY.

00:13:23.740 --> 00:13:25.417
I'M VERY QUALIFIED. IT'S NOT HAPPENING.

00:13:25.500 --> 00:13:29.627
>> DO YOU AGREE WITH THE NOTION
OF THE MOST ROBUST, POWERFUL AI

00:13:29.710 --> 00:13:32.867
MODELS SHOULD BE WITHHELD FROM THE
PUBLIC DUE TO CYBERSECURITY RISKS.

00:13:32.950 --> 00:13:35.467
>> LOOK, FROM. ANTHROPIC AND OPEN AI, YOU.

00:13:35.550 --> 00:13:38.267
>> REALLY HAVE TO MAKE THE ONE
OF ONE OF THE THINGS WE'RE

00:13:38.350 --> 00:13:41.307
REALLY TRYING TO GET THE WEST
TO DO IS MOVE AWAY FROM LIKE

00:13:41.390 --> 00:13:44.207
NOT LIKING IT. THESE ARE VERY
TECHNICAL. WHAT DOES THE MODEL

00:13:44.290 --> 00:13:48.347
DO? WHO IS RESTRICTED TO. I WOULD SAY IT
IS A LOSER TO RESTRICT SOMETHING FROM THE

00:13:48.430 --> 00:13:51.017
GOVERNMENT, BECAUSE YOU DON'T
AGREE WITH HOW THE GOVERNMENT

00:13:51.100 --> 00:13:54.017
FIGHTS WAR AND THEN OPEN IT
UP TO THE WORLD, INCLUDING OUR

00:13:54.100 --> 00:13:57.187
ADVERSARIES. GO SELL THAT TO THE AMERICAN
PEOPLE WHERE THEY ALREADY DON'T LIKE YOU.

00:13:57.270 --> 00:14:01.127
>> YOU HAVE A LOT OF DATA THAT
YOU LOOK AT. DO YOU THINK CHINA

00:14:01.210 --> 00:14:03.427
IS GETTING BETTER AT AI?
HOW IS THE GAP NARROWING?

00:14:03.510 --> 00:14:07.297
>> THERE ARE. >> TWO RELEVANT TECH
CENTERS IN TWO AND A HALF AMERICA, CHINA,

00:14:07.380 --> 00:14:12.437
ISRAEL. THOSE ARE THE TECH CENTERS OF THE
WORLD. AND WE LIKE I SPENT HALF MY LIFE IN

00:14:12.520 --> 00:14:15.467
EUROPE. I WANT EUROPE TO BE RELEVANT.
AND SWEDEN HAS A REAL

00:14:15.550 --> 00:14:18.437
TECH SCENE. YOU HAVE TO BE
CAN'T JUST LIKE YOU KNOW. BUT

00:14:18.520 --> 00:14:23.117
THE RELEVANT TECH CENTERS WE ARE.
WE HAVE A PEER TO PEER

00:14:23.200 --> 00:14:26.747
ADVERSARY IN CHINA. CHINA HAS
LOTS OF ADVANTAGES, INCLUDING.

00:14:26.830 --> 00:14:31.457
QUITE FRANKLY, WE HAVE TO FIND
WAYS TO MAKE THESE MODELS RAISE

00:14:31.540 --> 00:14:34.027
THE STANDARD OF LIVING
FOR EVERY AMERICA. AND WE NEED A

00:14:34.110 --> 00:14:37.027
SENSE AMERICANS NEED TO HAVE A SENSE.
IT'S NOT JUST THE PEOPLE

00:14:37.110 --> 00:14:39.267
AT THIS TABLE, PEOPLE WATCHING
IT GETTING RICH, AND THERE ARE

00:14:39.350 --> 00:14:41.127
REAL ISSUES THERE. AND WE HAVE.

00:14:41.210 --> 00:14:46.137
AND THEN WE HAVE LEFT AND RIGHT, FAR LEFT,
FAR RIGHT, GONE COMPLETELY NUTS. YOU WOULD

00:14:46.220 --> 00:14:49.407
THINK THAT THE GREATEST PROBLEM
IN THE WORLD IF YOU WERE ON THE

00:14:49.490 --> 00:14:53.007
FAR LEFT IS SOMEHOW IT'S LIKE
IF THINGS WORK, IT'S EVIL AND

00:14:53.090 --> 00:14:56.247
BAD. BY THE WAY, I'VE BEEN
WHOLESALE KICKED OUT OF MY OWN

00:14:56.330 --> 00:14:59.147
PARTY BECAUSE I WARNED THAT
THIS WAS GOING TO HAPPEN ON THE

00:14:59.230 --> 00:15:02.887
LEFT, AND IT IS HAPPENING.
THEN YOU HAVE ON THE FAR RIGHT, LIKE

00:15:02.970 --> 00:15:06.027
IT'S LIKE ON BOTH SIDES.
YOU THINK THE BIGGEST PROBLEM OF

00:15:06.110 --> 00:15:09.227
OUR SOCIETY ARE LIKE WARLOCKS
ROAMING THE STREET BUILDING

00:15:09.310 --> 00:15:11.527
TECHNOLOGY. THEY OF COURSE,
THEY CAN'T UNDERSTAND IT. LIKE

00:15:11.610 --> 00:15:13.927
THEY ATTACK PALANTIR FOR THE CRAZIEST.
CHINA DOESN'T HAVE

00:15:14.010 --> 00:15:16.037
THAT PROBLEM, BUT IT ALSO

00:15:16.120 --> 00:15:17.837
DOESN'T HAVE THE CREATIVITY AND

00:15:17.920 --> 00:15:22.207
INGENUITY AND, AND DEEP TECH

00:15:22.290 --> 00:15:25.807
CREATIVITY WE HAVE.
BUT THE REALITY IS IT'S NOT A FOREGONE

00:15:25.890 --> 00:15:29.447
CONCLUSION THAT WE WIN,
THAT WE HAVE WE HAVE THE BIGGEST

00:15:29.530 --> 00:15:33.177
PROBLEM IN THIS COUNTRY ON THESE DEBATES
IS WE DEBATE THESE THINGS AS IF WE DON'T

00:15:33.260 --> 00:15:37.057
HAVE ADVERSARIES. IT'S NOT
ACTUALLY TRUE. IT'S BINARY.

00:15:37.140 --> 00:15:40.687
THEY WILL WIN OR WE WILL WIN.
>> LET ME ASK YOU, I JUST WANT

00:15:40.770 --> 00:15:44.157
TO PIVOT TO A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT
CONVERSATION, BUT RELATED, YOU HAVE BEEN A

00:15:44.240 --> 00:15:47.097
PROPONENT AND GREAT SUPPORTER
OF ISRAEL OVER THE YEARS, GREAT

00:15:47.180 --> 00:15:50.967
SUPPORTER OF ISRAEL. AND RIGHT
NOW WE HAVE A CEASE FIRE IN THE

00:15:51.050 --> 00:15:53.137
MIDDLE EAST, WHICH WE HOPE

00:15:53.220 --> 00:15:58.237
HOLDS. HAVING SAID THAT, THERE
IS A BIT OF SPACE BETWEEN WHERE

00:15:58.320 --> 00:16:03.617
THE U.S. IS NOW AND WHERE NETANYAHU IS
ON WHAT IS HAPPENING HERE AND WHETHER THEY

00:16:03.700 --> 00:16:06.047
ULTIMATELY BE PROTECTED.
AND I'M CURIOUS, GIVEN THAT AND

00:16:06.130 --> 00:16:08.647
GIVEN ALSO YOUR RELATIONSHIP
WITH THE U.S. GOVERNMENT AND

00:16:08.730 --> 00:16:11.487
THE WORK YOU DO THERE,
HOW YOU THINK ABOUT THAT DISCONNECT?

00:16:11.570 --> 00:16:14.357
>> THE THIS IS LIKE SO MANY

00:16:14.440 --> 00:16:17.557
THINGS. I AM THE MOST PUBLICLY

00:16:17.640 --> 00:16:19.367
SUPPORTIVE CEO OF ISRAEL. AND

00:16:19.450 --> 00:16:22.627
THAT'S TRUE. I THINK ISRAEL IS

00:16:22.710 --> 00:16:26.737
A IS ON THE SIDE OF GOOD NOW IN

00:16:26.820 --> 00:16:31.277
PRIVATE, BECAUSE I HAVE. I'M KNOWN THERE.
TO BE FAIR, I'M PROBABLY ALSO THE MOST

00:16:31.360 --> 00:16:34.147
EFFECTIVE CRITIC OF LIKE,
HEY, I DIDN'T AGREE WITH THIS

00:16:34.230 --> 00:16:37.217
WITHOUT GOING. AND I WOULD BE
VERY HAPPY TO BE MORE IN PUBLIC

00:16:37.300 --> 00:16:40.447
ABOUT THAT. EXCEPT FOR,
I THINK, NOT ALL. THERE ARE MANY

00:16:40.530 --> 00:16:43.257
LEGITIMATE CRITICISMS OF ISRAEL
AND EVERY OTHER COUNTRY,

00:16:43.340 --> 00:16:46.787
ALTHOUGH I WOULD SAY,
DO YOU WANT A COUNTRY THAT CAN

00:16:46.870 --> 00:16:50.957
SOMETIMES BE DIFFICULT AS YOUR PARTNER,
OR DO YOU WANT A COUNTRY, OR DO YOU WANT

00:16:51.040 --> 00:16:53.957
PARTNERS THAT HAVE NO TECH
SCENE AS A PARTNER? AND SO LIKE,

00:16:54.040 --> 00:16:57.537
IT'S LIKE IN THIS WORLD, HAVING A,
A FULLY ADULT, INDEPENDENT

00:16:57.620 --> 00:17:00.507
ALIGNED COUNTRY THAT DOESN'T
ALWAYS AGREE WITH US IS MUCH

00:17:00.590 --> 00:17:03.537
BETTER THAN WHAT WE SOMEHOW
HAVE IN EUROPE. LIKE THAT'S WE

00:17:03.620 --> 00:17:07.277
DO NOT WANT THAT. YES. OKAY. SO

00:17:07.360 --> 00:17:10.917
LOOK, AMERICAN ISRAEL WILL
ALWAYS HAVE WILL NEVER BE FULLY

00:17:11.000 --> 00:17:14.847
ALIGNED. AND THAT'S TOTALLY OKAY.
MY POSITION IS THEY ARE A

00:17:14.930 --> 00:17:17.957
VERY IMPORTANT PARTNER AND WE
ARE PROUD TO SUPPORT THEM. AND

00:17:18.040 --> 00:17:22.087
IN PRIVATE, YOU CAN BET YOUR LAST DOLLAR
I CALL AND COMPLAIN ABOUT A LOT OF THINGS.

00:17:22.170 --> 00:17:25.227
>> SO WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THIS
MOU OR WHATEVER DEAL YOU THINK

00:17:25.310 --> 00:17:29.197
IS IS ON OFFER AND WHATEVER
THE DEAL THAT IS, DO YOU THINK THAT

00:17:29.280 --> 00:17:32.097
WE ARE NOW IN A BETTER
PLACE THAN WE WERE BEFORE?

00:17:32.180 --> 00:17:36.277
>> YOU MEAN IN. >> IRAN, IN IRAN, AND,
AND, AND VIS A VIS ALSO WHAT YOU THINK

00:17:36.360 --> 00:17:40.907
IT MEANS FOR ISRAEL? >> WELL, LOOK,
I DON'T ISRAEL, I'M GOING TO LEAVE THE I'M

00:17:40.990 --> 00:17:44.047
GOING TO LEAVE THE ISRAELI
THING FOR MY TALKING TO THEM IN

00:17:44.130 --> 00:17:46.877
PRIVATE, BECAUSE I JUST DON'T
THINK AT THIS POINT IT'S VERY

00:17:46.960 --> 00:17:50.787
HARD IN PUBLIC TO TALK ABOUT THEM BECAUSE
YOU JUST HAVE PEOPLE LOOK, THERE ARE

00:17:50.870 --> 00:17:51.787
LEGITIMATE CRITICISMS OF ISRAEL.

00:17:51.870 --> 00:17:53.857
HALF THE PEOPLE CRITICIZING
ISRAEL JUST DON'T BELIEVE IT

00:17:53.940 --> 00:17:56.857
SHOULD EXIST. AND THAT'S JUST
A FACT. AND SO LIKE, I'M NOT

00:17:56.940 --> 00:17:59.827
GOING TO LIKE TOTALLY PLAY INTO
THEIR HANDS BY SAYING THINGS I

00:17:59.910 --> 00:18:03.437
SAY IN PRIVATE IN AMERICA,
AMERICA HAS TO REP HIS OWN

00:18:03.520 --> 00:18:07.067
INTERESTS. DO I THINK IRAN'S
BEEN DEGRADED? YES. ARE THERE

00:18:07.150 --> 00:18:09.907
THINGS THAT I DON'T THINK ARE
IN THE PUBLIC SPACE THAT WOULD

00:18:09.990 --> 00:18:14.247
BE COMFORTING TO PEOPLE? IF THEY ARE,
YES, AND I'LL LEAVE IT AT THAT.

00:18:14.330 --> 00:18:17.517
>> WOW. PRETTY GREAT. >> THANK YOU.

00:18:17.600 --> 00:18:20.877
>> THANK YOU. >> THANK YOU. TAKE CARE.
HAVE TO GET UP FROM THE SEAT.

00:18:20.960 --> 00:18:25.717
>> YOU KNOW, I JUST LIKE I FEEL LIKE
I'M GOING TO BE KICKED OUT OF THE ROOM.

00:18:25.800 --> 00:18:28.187
>> NOPE. NEVER WIDE RANGING CONVERSATION.
I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

00:18:28.270 --> 00:18:32.897
>> NO, NOT LIKE YOUR PARTY. WE WANT YOU
TO. WE WANT YOU TO STAY. CAN YOU COME BACK

00:18:32.980 --> 00:18:35.927
TOMORROW? >> YEAH. NO, I'LL COME BACK.
I REALLY DO APPRECIATE.

00:18:36.010 --> 00:18:38.867
>> YOU TALKING. >> TO IT.
>> YEAH. YOU KNOW, THE THING I

00:18:38.950 --> 00:18:43.037
ACTUALLY LIKE ABOUT YOU GUYS THE MOST AND
I WATCH YOU IS JUST THAT YOU ACTUALLY. AND

00:18:43.120 --> 00:18:44.907
IT'S VERY HARD TO PULL THIS OFF.

00:18:44.990 --> 00:18:47.907
YOU ACTUALLY HAVE DIVERGENT OPINIONS,
AND SOMEHOW YOU GUYS STAY TOGETHER.

00:18:47.990 --> 00:18:49.947
>> THIS IS TRUE. >> IT'S STILL ON CAMERA.

00:18:50.030 --> 00:18:51.947
>> OH, YEAH. >> WELL, GREAT. THAT'S TRUE.

00:18:52.030 --> 00:18:54.717
>> YOU ACTUALLY LIKE IT'S
HONESTLY, IT'S SO BORING. THE

00:18:54.800 --> 00:18:58.617
OTHER STUFF LIKE. AND AGAIN,
I GET KICKED OUT OF THESE ROOMS.

00:18:58.700 --> 00:19:03.927
EVEN IF EVEN IF I AGREED WITH YOU, I WOULD
TRY TO DISAGREE WITH YOU. IT'S MORE FUN.

00:19:04.010 --> 00:19:06.497
>> THERE'S SEYMA. THANK YOU
FOR BRINGING ALEX HERE THIS MORNING.

00:19:06.580 --> 00:19:09.227
THANK YOU FOR YOUR PERSPECTIVE
ON THIS, ALEX. THANK YOU. WE

00:19:09.310 --> 00:19:10.397
APPRECIATE IT VERY, VERY MUCH.

00:19:10.480 --> 00:19:12.367
THANKS. >> PEOPLE LIVE IN ECHO CHAMBERS.

00:19:12.450 --> 00:19:15.467
>> IT'S IT'S BEEN SO OFFENDED
TO HEAR DIVERGENT OPINION. IT'S LIKE,

00:19:15.550 --> 00:19:20.577
>> WHAT DO YOU LIKE? IT'S SO CRAZY.
AND I'LL TELL YOU, WE'RE OFF CAMERA NOW.

00:19:20.660 --> 00:19:23.577
>> NO, WE'RE STILL GOING.
>> LET ME GET OFF CAMERA. WHAT,

00:19:23.660 --> 00:19:25.877
DO YOU WANT ME TO READ
THIS TRUMP STUFF OR NOT?

00:19:25.960 --> 00:19:31.317
>> YOU KNOW? >> OKAY, HOLD ON, ALEX.
I NOW NOW WE'RE STILL ON AND I'M

00:19:31.400 --> 00:19:34.927
GOING TO READ THIS BECAUSE PRESIDENT TRUMP
WAS JUST SPEAKING TO REPORTERS AT JOINT

00:19:35.010 --> 00:19:38.257
BASE ANDREWS. HE'S PREPARING
TO TAKE HIS FIRST FLIGHT ON THE

00:19:38.340 --> 00:19:42.937
QATARI GIFTED AIR FORCE ONE. HE'S EN ROUTE
TO NORTH DAKOTA FOR THE OPENING OF TEDDY

00:19:43.020 --> 00:19:45.720
ROOSEVELT'S PRESIDENTIAL
LIBRARY. HE ADDRESSED