WEBVTT 00:00:00.180 --> 00:00:04.537 A conversation with Elon Musk is probably one of the most unpredictable 00:00:04.620 --> 00:00:08.640 and most testing experiences a journalist can have. 00:00:08.910 --> 00:00:14.047 At least that's how it proved for me. What you're about to hear was recorded 00:00:14.130 --> 00:00:18.750 in May 2025 at Bloomberg's Qatar Economic Forum. 00:00:19.140 --> 00:00:23.917 Elon Musk was, at that time still working with the Trump administration, running 00:00:24.000 --> 00:00:27.060 DOGE, the Department for Government Efficiency. 00:00:27.360 --> 00:00:32.587 It was a few months on from his big pledge to cut $2 trillion from the US 00:00:32.670 --> 00:00:36.577 federal budget. So I wanted to ask him how that was 00:00:36.660 --> 00:00:41.190 going and about his companies, Tesla and Starlink among them. 00:00:41.670 --> 00:00:45.030 And here's what actually happened when we spoke. 00:00:53.680 --> 00:00:56.147 Elon Musk, welcome to Qatar Economic Forum. 00:00:56.230 --> 00:00:58.420 How are you? Thank you for having me. 00:00:58.510 --> 00:00:59.610 I'm fine. How are you? 00:01:00.250 --> 00:01:02.617 Very well, thank you. And very pleased to have you with us. 00:01:02.700 --> 00:01:06.587 You know, among those here in the audience in Doha are some you will know 00:01:06.670 --> 00:01:11.507 people who have backed you financially over the years since you last spoke here 00:01:11.590 --> 00:01:13.967 in 2022. A lot has changed in your life. 00:01:14.050 --> 00:01:17.777 You're not only running multiple companies, you were doing that then, but 00:01:17.860 --> 00:01:20.927 now you also have a role in government. So first of all, I hope you won't mind 00:01:21.010 --> 00:01:24.617 if from time to time I have to move you from one topic to another, because we 00:01:24.700 --> 00:01:28.600 have a lot to cover in the time we have. Sure fire away. Will that be alright? 00:01:28.930 --> 00:01:31.937 Okay. Well, let's start then, with exactly the 00:01:32.020 --> 00:01:36.737 fact that you now have this combination of being a CEO and having a role as a 00:01:36.820 --> 00:01:39.020 government advisor. Tell me about your week. 00:01:39.160 --> 00:01:42.280 How does it work? What's the split of your time? 00:01:43.560 --> 00:01:49.837 Well, I travel a lot, so I was in Silicon Valley yesterday morning. 00:01:49.920 --> 00:01:52.170 I was in L.A. yesterday evening. 00:01:52.260 --> 00:01:54.877 I'm in Austin right now. I'll be in D.C. 00:01:54.960 --> 00:01:58.897 tomorrow. I'll be there after having dinner with 00:01:58.980 --> 00:02:01.430 the president tomorrow night, I believe. And then 00:02:03.700 --> 00:02:07.606 whole bunch of cabinet secretary meetings and then back to Silicon Valley 00:02:07.689 --> 00:02:11.897 on Thursday night. But I mean, the balance of your time. 00:02:11.980 --> 00:02:14.147 It's a lot. Well, clearly it's a lot. 00:02:14.230 --> 00:02:18.077 But is it still the case, as you said a while ago, that it's about 1 to 2 days a 00:02:18.160 --> 00:02:21.850 week on your government work? Yeah, that's correct. 00:02:22.480 --> 00:02:26.477 And what does that mean for your corporate life? 00:02:26.560 --> 00:02:31.037 Because if we start with Tesla, the company has suffered in recent months 00:02:31.120 --> 00:02:37.037 what you've called blowback. So what is your plan for turning that 00:02:37.120 --> 00:02:41.717 around, the declining sales picture? And by what stage do you think you're 00:02:41.800 --> 00:02:44.640 going to be able to turn it around? Oh, 00:02:44.740 --> 00:02:49.437 it's already turned around. Give me some evidence for that. 00:02:49.520 --> 00:02:54.027 I've just been looking at the sales figures for Europe in April, which 00:02:54.110 --> 00:02:56.840 show very significant declines in the big markets. 00:02:58.440 --> 00:03:01.390 Europe is our weakest market, we're strong everywhere else. 00:03:02.330 --> 00:03:05.850 So our sales are doing doing well at this point. 00:03:07.570 --> 00:03:11.040 We don't anticipate any any meaningful sales shortfall and 00:03:13.190 --> 00:03:18.597 the you know, the obviously, the stock market recognizes that since we're now 00:03:18.680 --> 00:03:20.647 back over trillion in market cap. 00:03:20.730 --> 00:03:24.327 So clearly the market is aware of the situation. 00:03:24.410 --> 00:03:27.327 So it's already turned around. But sales are still down compared to 00:03:27.410 --> 00:03:30.610 this time last year. In Europe. 00:03:31.030 --> 00:03:35.980 In Europe. Okay. Yes, but that, but that's that's true of all 00:03:36.160 --> 00:03:38.740 manufacturers. There's no exceptions. 00:03:40.620 --> 00:03:42.547 Does that mean that you're not going to be able. 00:03:42.630 --> 00:03:45.270 Yes. The European market is quite weak. 00:03:45.690 --> 00:03:49.717 Okay. But you would acknowledge, wouldn't you, that what you are facing, okay, 00:03:49.800 --> 00:03:52.267 Let's just take it as Europe, What you are facing is a significant 00:03:52.350 --> 00:03:53.977 problem. This Tesla was an incredibly 00:03:54.060 --> 00:03:57.750 aspirational brand. People identified with it, it saw it, 00:03:58.140 --> 00:04:00.577 they saw it as being at the forefront of the climate crisis. 00:04:00.660 --> 00:04:04.117 And now people are driving around with stickers in their cars saying, I bought 00:04:04.200 --> 00:04:09.457 this before we knew Elon was crazy. And there are also people who are buying it 00:04:09.540 --> 00:04:13.710 it because Elon's crazy or however they may view it. 00:04:15.030 --> 00:04:18.127 So, yes, we've lost some sales perhaps on the left, but we've gained them on 00:04:18.210 --> 00:04:21.517 the right. The sales numbers at this point are 00:04:21.600 --> 00:04:24.760 strong and we see no problem with demand. 00:04:25.380 --> 00:04:28.357 So what - And I mean, you can just look at the stock 00:04:28.440 --> 00:04:32.670 price, but if you want the best insider information, the 00:04:34.080 --> 00:04:40.897 stock market analysts have that. And a stock wouldn't be trading near all 00:04:40.980 --> 00:04:45.240 time highs if it was not if things weren't in good shape. They're fine. 00:04:45.540 --> 00:04:49.277 Don't worry about it. Okay. I was citing sales figures rather than share price. 00:04:49.360 --> 00:04:52.927 Well, tell me then how committed you are to Tesla. 00:04:53.010 --> 00:04:56.137 Do you see yourself and are you committed to still being the chief 00:04:56.220 --> 00:05:03.220 executive of Tesla in five years time? Yes. No doubt about that at all. 00:05:05.970 --> 00:05:11.527 Well, no, I might die. Okay. 00:05:11.610 --> 00:05:13.234 Short of that. I can't be, I can't see you if I'm dead, 00:05:13.318 --> 00:05:14.868 so there's a slight amount of - 00:05:15.800 --> 00:05:21.217 Does does that mean that the value of your pay doesn't have any bearing on 00:05:21.300 --> 00:05:28.217 your decision? Well, that's not really a subject for 00:05:28.300 --> 00:05:31.300 discussion in this forum, but. 00:05:32.680 --> 00:05:38.147 I think obviously there should be compensation for if something incredible 00:05:38.230 --> 00:05:43.300 is done, that compensation should match it, that something incredible was done. 00:05:45.530 --> 00:05:51.410 But I'm confident that whatever the whatever some activist posing as a judge 00:05:51.560 --> 00:05:55.060 in Delaware happens to do, it will not affect the future compensation. 00:05:55.850 --> 00:06:00.620 This is the judge who twice struck down the $56 billion 00:06:00.860 --> 00:06:03.267 pay package that was that was awarded to you. 00:06:03.350 --> 00:06:07.197 I think the value on the basis on the current value of stock options. 00:06:07.280 --> 00:06:12.177 Yeah. Not a judge, not a judge. The activist who is cosplaying a judge 00:06:12.260 --> 00:06:15.357 in a Halloween costume. Okay. 00:06:15.440 --> 00:06:19.737 That's that's your characterization. Yes. I think on the current value of 00:06:19.820 --> 00:06:24.087 stock options - justice according to the law - on the 00:06:24.170 --> 00:06:27.477 current value of stock options, I think the value that pay package stands at 00:06:27.560 --> 00:06:31.797 about 00 billion. Are you saying you are relaxed about the 00:06:31.880 --> 00:06:37.647 value of your future pay package, your decision to be committed to Tesla for 00:06:37.730 --> 00:06:41.517 the next five years, as long as you are still with us on this planet is 00:06:41.600 --> 00:06:45.150 completely independent of pay. No. 00:06:47.750 --> 00:06:50.637 It's not independent, so pay is a relevant factor then to your commitment 00:06:50.720 --> 00:06:56.080 to Tesla. A sufficient voting control such that 00:06:57.250 --> 00:07:00.647 I cannot be ousted by activist investors is what matters to me. 00:07:00.730 --> 00:07:04.577 And I've said this publicly many times. But let's not have this whole thing be a 00:07:04.660 --> 00:07:07.547 discussion of my alleged pay, it's not a money thing. 00:07:07.630 --> 00:07:11.627 It's a reasonable control thing over the future of the company, especially if 00:07:11.710 --> 00:07:14.960 we're building millions, potentially billions of humanoid robots. 00:07:15.580 --> 00:07:19.840 I can't be sitting there and wondering to get tossed out by 00:07:21.010 --> 00:07:23.747 for political reasons by activists. That would be unacceptable. 00:07:23.830 --> 00:07:26.050 That's all that matters. Now, let's move on. 00:07:26.260 --> 00:07:28.487 Okay. Well, just one question. 00:07:28.570 --> 00:07:30.010 Now let's move on. 00:07:31.300 --> 00:07:35.177 Well one question before we move on to other companies, which is that I wonder if 00:07:35.260 --> 00:07:38.920 some of what you've has happened to Tesla in the last few months. 00:07:39.280 --> 00:07:42.640 Did you take it personally? Yes. 00:07:44.150 --> 00:07:48.657 And did it make you regret any of the old think twice about your political 00:07:48.740 --> 00:07:49.573 endeavors? 00:07:57.990 --> 00:08:01.860 Because it is. I did what needed to be done. 00:08:02.850 --> 00:08:06.000 The violent antibody reaction. 00:08:07.170 --> 00:08:09.670 And I'm not someone who's ever committed violence. 00:08:10.080 --> 00:08:13.560 And yet massive violence was committed against 00:08:13.680 --> 00:08:16.357 my companies. Massive violence was threatened against 00:08:16.440 --> 00:08:19.290 me. Who are these people? 00:08:19.800 --> 00:08:23.880 Why would they do that? How wrong can they be? 00:08:24.420 --> 00:08:26.450 They're on the wrong side of history. 00:08:27.550 --> 00:08:32.110 And that's an evil thing to do to go and damage some poor innocent person's car. 00:08:34.470 --> 00:08:38.280 To threaten to kill me. What's wrong with these people? 00:08:39.060 --> 00:08:42.690 I've not harmed anyone. So, 00:08:44.010 --> 00:08:47.960 something needs to be done about them. And a number of them are going to prison 00:08:48.180 --> 00:08:53.017 and they deserve it. And more will. You're referring to 00:08:53.100 --> 00:08:59.557 the attacks on Tesla's showrooms. But I think - Yeah. Well, it's the showrooms and 00:08:59.640 --> 00:09:01.640 burning down cars is unacceptable. Yeah. 00:09:01.860 --> 00:09:05.017 Those people will go to prison and the people that funded them and organized 00:09:05.100 --> 00:09:07.657 them will also go to prison. Don't worry. We're coming for you. 00:09:07.740 --> 00:09:10.290 But wouldn't you, wouldn't, wouldn't you, 00:09:15.940 --> 00:09:18.977 but wouldn't you acknowledge that some of the people who turned against Tesla 00:09:19.060 --> 00:09:24.977 in Europe were were upset at your politics and very few of them would have 00:09:25.060 --> 00:09:29.627 been violent in any way? They just objected to to what they saw 00:09:29.710 --> 00:09:34.917 you say or do politically. Well, it's certainly fine to object to 00:09:35.000 --> 00:09:39.207 political things, but it's not it's not fine to resort to violence and hanging 00:09:39.290 --> 00:09:43.220 someone in effigy and death threats. That's obviously not okay. 00:09:45.710 --> 00:09:51.500 You know, that's absurd. That is in no way justifiable at all. 00:09:53.040 --> 00:09:56.917 In any way, shape or form. And some of the legacy media nonetheless 00:09:57.000 --> 00:09:59.347 have sought to justify it, which is unconscionable. 00:09:59.430 --> 00:10:02.497 Shame on them. Let's talk about your other companies 00:10:02.580 --> 00:10:04.530 then. Another business area, Space X. 00:10:04.740 --> 00:10:09.367 I saw that you said in a speech at the West Point Military Academy recently 00:10:09.450 --> 00:10:13.297 that the future of warfare is AI and drones. 00:10:13.380 --> 00:10:19.357 And obviously defense is an increasingly booming sector with the state of the 00:10:19.440 --> 00:10:23.970 world at the moment. Do you see Space X moving into weaponized drones? 00:10:31.960 --> 00:10:36.340 You certainly ask interesting questions that are impossible to answer. 00:10:37.570 --> 00:10:43.780 So SpaceX is a it's the space launch leader. 00:10:43.900 --> 00:10:48.970 So SpaceX doesn't do drones. SpaceX builds rockets, satellites and 00:10:49.540 --> 00:10:56.540 internet terminals. So SpaceX has has a a very dominant 00:10:57.430 --> 00:11:01.517 position in space launch. So of the mass launch to orbit the 00:11:01.600 --> 00:11:08.600 sphere, SpaceX will probably do 90% China will do the remain, half 00:11:10.270 --> 00:11:13.007 of the remaining amount so 5% and the rest of the world including the rest of 00:11:13.090 --> 00:11:16.037 US, will do about 5%. So SpaceX will be about ten times as 00:11:16.120 --> 00:11:19.247 much as the rest of the world combined, or 20 times as much as China, which is - 00:11:19.330 --> 00:11:21.830 and China is doing actually a very impressive job. 00:11:22.150 --> 00:11:25.727 The reason for this is that we are putting into orbit the largest satellite 00:11:25.810 --> 00:11:28.120 constellation the world has ever seen by far. 00:11:28.930 --> 00:11:35.177 So I think at this point, about maybe approaching 80% of all active satellites 00:11:35.260 --> 00:11:40.510 in orbit are SpaceX, and they're providing global high bandwidth global 00:11:41.410 --> 00:11:43.487 connectivity throughout the world. In fact, this connection is on the SpaceX 00:11:43.570 --> 00:11:47.590 connection. So I think this is a very good thing 00:11:48.130 --> 00:11:53.147 because it means that we can provide low cost, high bandwidth internet to parts 00:11:53.230 --> 00:11:55.517 of the world that don't have it or it's very expensive. 00:11:55.600 --> 00:11:59.987 And I think the single biggest thing you can do to lift people out of poverty and 00:12:00.070 --> 00:12:03.220 help them is giving them an internet connection. 00:12:04.180 --> 00:12:06.677 Because once you have the Internet connection, you can learn anything for 00:12:06.760 --> 00:12:10.427 free on the Internet and you can also sell your goods and services to the 00:12:10.510 --> 00:12:13.090 global market. And 00:12:14.700 --> 00:12:20.360 once you have knowledge by the internet and the ability to engage in commerce, 00:12:21.830 --> 00:12:26.037 this is going to greatly improve quality of life for people throughout the world. 00:12:26.120 --> 00:12:29.697 And it has. And I'd just like to thank anyone in the 00:12:29.780 --> 00:12:32.230 audience who may have been helpful and, you know, 00:12:33.400 --> 00:12:36.747 with Starlink and getting it approved in their country. 00:12:36.830 --> 00:12:39.147 And I think it's doing a lot of good in the countries that have approved it, 00:12:39.230 --> 00:12:42.730 which is, I think at this point, 130 countries are very happy with it. 00:12:43.670 --> 00:12:46.767 I don't currently anticipate SpaceX getting into the weapons 00:12:46.850 --> 00:12:48.807 business. That's certainly, that's not an 00:12:48.890 --> 00:12:53.157 aspiration. We're frequently asked to do to do weapons 00:12:53.240 --> 00:12:59.847 programs, but we have thus far declined. Do you envisage SpaceX or indeed 00:12:59.930 --> 00:13:05.840 Starlink, as a separate entity publicly listing in the near future or at all? 00:13:08.720 --> 00:13:13.040 It's possible that Starlink may go public at some point in the future. 00:13:14.490 --> 00:13:17.140 And what would be that, what would be the time frame? 00:13:18.910 --> 00:13:21.407 What kind of time frame are you considering? I'm in no rush. 00:13:21.490 --> 00:13:27.030 I'm in no rush to go public. You know public is, I guess, a way to 00:13:28.920 --> 00:13:33.287 you know potentially make more money, but at the expense of a lot of public company 00:13:33.370 --> 00:13:38.297 overhead and inevitably a whole bunch of lawsuits which are very 00:13:38.380 --> 00:13:41.057 annoying. So really, something needs to be done 00:13:41.140 --> 00:13:46.510 about the shareholder derivative lawsuits in the U.S. because it allows 00:13:49.510 --> 00:13:53.267 plaintiff's law firms who don't represent the shareholders to pretend that they 00:13:53.350 --> 00:13:57.347 represent the shareholders by getting a public plaintiff with a few shares to 00:13:57.430 --> 00:13:59.780 initiate a massive lawsuit against the company. 00:13:59.950 --> 00:14:05.627 And the irony being that, extreme irony, that even if the class they purport to 00:14:05.710 --> 00:14:09.647 represent were to vote, that they don't want the lawsuit, the lawsuit will still 00:14:09.730 --> 00:14:13.337 continue. So how can it be a class action 00:14:13.420 --> 00:14:15.920 representing a class if the class were against it? 00:14:16.180 --> 00:14:18.527 And that's the bizarre situation we've got in the U.S. 00:14:18.610 --> 00:14:20.530 It needs, it's in dire need of reform. 00:14:21.610 --> 00:14:25.757 And as anyone who's run a public company experiences, it's an absurd 00:14:25.840 --> 00:14:28.967 situation that needs to change. Well, do you think Donald Trump might 00:14:29.050 --> 00:14:30.887 change it? You've certainly got his ear. 00:14:30.970 --> 00:14:34.847 I imagine that you've put this to him. Is this something you're trying to 00:14:34.930 --> 00:14:39.880 change before any StarLink IPO? Well, 00:14:41.090 --> 00:14:47.017 it would need a law to be passed. The trouble being that you need 60 00:14:47.100 --> 00:14:51.480 Senate votes and the Democrats will vote against it. 00:14:52.170 --> 00:14:57.427 The, the plaintiff's bar is, I 00:14:57.510 --> 00:15:00.710 believe, the second largest contributor to the Democratic Party. 00:15:02.650 --> 00:15:04.967 That's the that's the issue. At the state level, 00:15:05.050 --> 00:15:09.407 this can be solved, and I should say Texas recently passed a 00:15:09.490 --> 00:15:12.790 law which at least the state level made - 00:15:14.430 --> 00:15:17.362 it's much more reasonable, because you have to get at least one in 33 00:15:17.446 --> 00:15:22.920 shareholders to agree that they are part of a class of shareholders, 3%. 00:15:24.510 --> 00:15:28.170 This is it, this will be, will be really help with frivolous lawsuits. 00:15:28.830 --> 00:15:33.397 Okay. Let's talk about AI, which is in so 00:15:33.480 --> 00:15:38.197 many of your businesses and in all our worlds in different ways. 00:15:38.280 --> 00:15:42.937 It's one of the big changes, the development of generative AI since you 00:15:43.020 --> 00:15:45.967 last spoke to this forum three years ago. 00:15:46.050 --> 00:15:49.687 You're in this space, of course, with Grok, which almost everyone will know. 00:15:49.770 --> 00:15:54.780 You co-founded OpenAI and then left, and you've obviously got a legal battle 00:15:55.350 --> 00:15:58.477 with OpenAI and Sam Altman. But I wonder if you could say something 00:15:58.560 --> 00:16:02.797 about the status of that because you were together in Saudi Arabia with the 00:16:02.880 --> 00:16:06.390 president last week with Sam Altman - Not together. 00:16:06.474 --> 00:16:08.857 In the same place at the same time. 00:16:08.940 --> 00:16:12.332 I was with the president and Sam was in the neighborhood. 00:16:12.415 --> 00:16:19.050 Does that mean you are pushing ahead with the lawsuit against OpenAI? Yes. 00:16:20.610 --> 00:16:27.577 So I came up with the name OpenAI as an open source and as a non-profit, and I 00:16:27.660 --> 00:16:31.920 funded AI, OpenAI for the first roughly $50 million. 00:16:33.750 --> 00:16:38.347 And it was intended to be a nonprofit open source company. 00:16:38.430 --> 00:16:44.137 And now they're trying to change that for their own financial benefit into a 00:16:44.220 --> 00:16:46.590 for profit company that is closed source. 00:16:47.010 --> 00:16:52.657 So this would be like, let's say you you funded a nonprofit to help preserve 00:16:52.740 --> 00:16:56.287 the Amazon rainforest. But instead of doing that, they became a 00:16:56.370 --> 00:16:58.237 lumber company, chopped down the forest to sold the wood. 00:16:58.320 --> 00:17:01.170 You'd be like, wait a second, that's not what I funded. 00:17:02.670 --> 00:17:04.687 That's OpenAI. They've made some changes to their 00:17:04.770 --> 00:17:07.260 corporate structure, though, haven't they, since, 00:17:07.560 --> 00:17:10.680 in recognition of what, of what you've said and - 00:17:12.060 --> 00:17:14.110 No, that's just what they told the media. 00:17:14.990 --> 00:17:17.790 Okay. It's 00:17:19.090 --> 00:17:20.547 hot. They have, 00:17:20.630 --> 00:17:25.167 they have partly walked back their plan to restructure the business. 00:17:25.250 --> 00:17:27.867 I guess that's made no difference to how you feel about it. 00:17:27.950 --> 00:17:31.500 So you're determined to see them in court? Of course. 00:17:32.190 --> 00:17:34.087 Okay. Well, that that's certainly going to be 00:17:34.170 --> 00:17:36.757 one to watch. I also wanted to ask you about AI and 00:17:36.840 --> 00:17:40.357 regulation, because when you were here last talking to John Micklethwait, you 00:17:40.440 --> 00:17:45.337 had some pretty strong words about the risk that AI poses. 00:17:45.420 --> 00:17:48.997 And you said that you really felt what the U.S. 00:17:49.080 --> 00:17:53.557 was missing was a federal AI regulator, that, you know, something along the 00:17:53.640 --> 00:17:56.497 lines of the Food and Drug Administration or the Federal Aviation 00:17:56.580 --> 00:17:59.970 Administration. Now, you're clearly now in a zone where 00:18:00.330 --> 00:18:03.457 you're more you're more on the cutting regulation side than wanting new 00:18:03.540 --> 00:18:06.637 regulators. So has your view changed on the need for 00:18:06.720 --> 00:18:10.477 an AI regulator? Well, it's not that I don't think there 00:18:10.560 --> 00:18:14.317 should be regulators. You think of regulators like referees on 00:18:14.400 --> 00:18:18.007 the, on the field, in sports, there should be some number 00:18:18.090 --> 00:18:21.367 of referees, but that you shouldn't have so many referees that you can't kick the 00:18:21.450 --> 00:18:28.450 ball without hitting one. So in many and most of our fields in the 00:18:29.160 --> 00:18:31.657 U.S., the regulatory burden has grown over 00:18:31.740 --> 00:18:36.307 time to the point where it's like having more referees than than players on the 00:18:36.390 --> 00:18:38.580 field. So 00:18:39.750 --> 00:18:42.967 and this is a natural consequence of an extended period of prosperity. 00:18:43.050 --> 00:18:45.390 It's very important to appreciate this. 00:18:45.720 --> 00:18:48.697 This has happened throughout history. When you have an extended period of 00:18:48.780 --> 00:18:52.080 prosperity with no existential war, there's no there's no 00:18:53.220 --> 00:18:59.760 cleansing function for the unnecessary laws and regulations. 00:18:59.880 --> 00:19:04.597 So what happens is that every year more laws and more regulations are passed 00:19:04.680 --> 00:19:07.687 because, you know, legislators are going to 00:19:07.770 --> 00:19:10.897 legislate. Regulators are going to regulate, and 00:19:10.980 --> 00:19:15.900 you'll get a steady pile of more and more laws and regulations over time. 00:19:16.410 --> 00:19:20.850 And so everything is illegal. And let me give you an example of a 00:19:21.180 --> 00:19:25.770 truly absurd situation. Under the Biden administration, SpaceX 00:19:27.000 --> 00:19:31.110 was sued for not hiring asylum seekers in the U.S.. 00:19:32.340 --> 00:19:36.170 Now, the problem is it's actually illegal for SpaceX under ITAR, 00:19:36.450 --> 00:19:40.267 International Traffic and Arms Regulation, to hire anyone who is not a 00:19:40.350 --> 00:19:44.287 permanent resident of the United States, because the premise being that they will 00:19:44.370 --> 00:19:47.407 take advanced rocket technology and return it to their home country if they're 00:19:47.490 --> 00:19:50.460 not a permanent resident. So we're simultaneously 00:19:51.840 --> 00:19:55.440 in a situation where it is illegal to hire asylum seekers and it is also 00:19:56.220 --> 00:20:01.627 illegal to hire asylum seekers. And Biden's Department of Justice chose 00:20:01.710 --> 00:20:05.010 to prosecute us despite both paths being illegal. 00:20:05.670 --> 00:20:08.513 Damned if you do, damned if you don't. How absurd is - But my question 00:20:08.597 --> 00:20:09.517 was specifically about a 00:20:09.600 --> 00:20:14.467 regulator for AI, which you said three years ago was needed, and you said we 00:20:14.550 --> 00:20:19.177 need to be proactive on the regulation of AI, rather than reactive. 00:20:19.260 --> 00:20:22.260 Have you changed your mind on that? No, of course not. 00:20:23.250 --> 00:20:26.107 No, of course not. What I'm saying is that there should be 00:20:26.190 --> 00:20:30.547 some referees on the field, a few referees, but you shouldn't have a 00:20:30.630 --> 00:20:35.197 field jam packed with referees, such that you could not kick a ball in any 00:20:35.280 --> 00:20:39.127 direction without hitting one. So the the fields that have been around 00:20:39.210 --> 00:20:43.770 for a long time, such as automotive, aerospace, 00:20:45.390 --> 00:20:50.220 you know, of the sort of food and drug industries are overregulated. 00:20:51.090 --> 00:20:55.597 But the new fields like artificial intelligence, are underregulated. 00:20:55.680 --> 00:20:58.680 In fact, there is no regulator at all. So there should be. 00:20:59.070 --> 00:21:01.537 You still think that. Yes. 00:21:01.620 --> 00:21:05.970 I'm simply saying, which I think is just basic common sense that you want to have 00:21:06.390 --> 00:21:08.827 at least you want you want to have a few referees in the field. 00:21:08.910 --> 00:21:13.777 You don't want have an army of referees, but you want to have a few referees on 00:21:13.860 --> 00:21:19.957 on any given field, in any given sport or any given arena industrial arena to 00:21:20.040 --> 00:21:24.000 ensure, help that public safety is taken care of. 00:21:24.690 --> 00:21:27.900 But you don't have. So so there's a there's a there's a 00:21:28.350 --> 00:21:31.327 proper number of referees. But like I said, it's actually very easy 00:21:31.410 --> 00:21:33.540 to visualize this when compared to sports. 00:21:33.810 --> 00:21:37.620 If the whole field is packed with referees, that would look absurd. 00:21:38.640 --> 00:21:42.390 But if there were no referees at all, your game is not going to be as good. 00:21:42.960 --> 00:21:46.867 Okay. So let's then talk about your new world, 00:21:46.950 --> 00:21:52.357 your your role advising government. You are in this unique and unprecedented 00:21:52.440 --> 00:21:56.377 position of having billions of dollars worth of contracts with the federal 00:21:56.460 --> 00:21:58.610 government yourself, mostly through SpaceX, 00:21:59.010 --> 00:22:02.820 and also now an insider's knowledge of it because of DOGE. 00:22:03.180 --> 00:22:08.887 Can you see that there is a conflict of interest or a potential conflict of 00:22:08.970 --> 00:22:11.620 interest in broad terms, just through that very fact? 00:22:13.870 --> 00:22:16.920 I don't think so, actually. There have been many advisors in 00:22:17.710 --> 00:22:21.250 throughout history and the U.S. government and others who have had 00:22:21.610 --> 00:22:25.660 economic interests. And I am certainly an advisor. 00:22:26.020 --> 00:22:32.597 I don't have formal power and that's it. And the president can choose to accept my 00:22:32.680 --> 00:22:35.530 advice or not. And that's that's how it goes. 00:22:36.160 --> 00:22:40.127 If there's a single contract that any of my companies have ever received that 00:22:40.210 --> 00:22:46.427 people think is somehow not was was awarded improperly, it would 00:22:46.510 --> 00:22:50.020 immediately be front page news, to say the least. 00:22:51.220 --> 00:22:54.220 And if I didn't mention it, certainly my competitors would. 00:22:54.430 --> 00:22:58.280 So if you're not seeing that then clearly there's not a conflict of interest. 00:22:59.260 --> 00:23:02.477 Yeah. There's another way, though, to look at 00:23:02.560 --> 00:23:06.617 it that, for example, you have many competitors, whether it's companies like 00:23:06.700 --> 00:23:10.127 Boeing or companies who would like to do more of the kind of work you do for 00:23:10.210 --> 00:23:16.127 NASA, Blue Origin, Rocket Lab. And because DOGE is in every federal 00:23:16.210 --> 00:23:22.727 government department, you or people who work for DOGE, and and you are the 00:23:22.810 --> 00:23:28.277 driving force behind it have an insight into those company's affairs and those 00:23:28.360 --> 00:23:30.960 company's relationships with the federal government. 00:23:32.700 --> 00:23:38.797 No. All we do is we review the organization to see if the organization 00:23:38.880 --> 00:23:43.350 has departments that are no longer relevant 00:23:44.580 --> 00:23:49.297 and are and are the contracts that are being awarded good value for money. 00:23:49.380 --> 00:23:51.517 In fact, frankly the bar is not particularly high. 00:23:51.600 --> 00:23:53.750 Is there any value for money in a contract? 00:23:54.480 --> 00:23:58.330 And if there's if there isn't, then we make recommendations to the secretary. 00:23:58.560 --> 00:24:03.214 The secretary can then choose to take those actions or not take those actions, 00:24:03.298 --> 00:24:07.087 and that's it. And then any action that that that is as 00:24:07.170 --> 00:24:12.510 a function of DOGE is posted to the DGOE website and to doge.gov, @DOGE 00:24:13.230 --> 00:24:18.337 handle on the X platform. So it's it's complete transparency and I 00:24:18.420 --> 00:24:23.347 have not seen any case where to the best of my knowledge there's even been 00:24:23.430 --> 00:24:27.990 an accusation of conflict because it is completely and utterly transparent. 00:24:29.490 --> 00:24:31.297 That's it. And what about the international 00:24:31.380 --> 00:24:33.907 dimension? Now let's think about Starlink. 00:24:33.990 --> 00:24:37.147 Starlink has obviously a very, very good internet service. 00:24:37.230 --> 00:24:40.747 It's sought after all over the world. It's critical to the frontline in 00:24:40.830 --> 00:24:44.677 Ukraine. It has also had more contracts coming 00:24:44.760 --> 00:24:46.867 its way. And there is some evidence that 00:24:46.950 --> 00:24:51.637 companies are allowing access to it because they want to be close to the 00:24:51.720 --> 00:24:53.627 Trump administration and send the right signal. 00:24:53.710 --> 00:24:57.367 So Bloomberg broke news today that the South African government is working 00:24:57.450 --> 00:25:01.207 around the rules on Black ownership in order to allow Starlink in. 00:25:01.290 --> 00:25:06.217 And that is being done on the eve of the visit the president, Ramaphosa, is going 00:25:06.300 --> 00:25:09.697 to make to the White House. Do you recognize that as a conflict of 00:25:09.780 --> 00:25:14.757 interest? No, of course not. First of all, you should be questioning why is there, 00:25:14.840 --> 00:25:17.757 why are there racist laws in South Africa? That's the first problem. 00:25:17.840 --> 00:25:21.327 That's why you should be attacking. It's improper for there to be racist 00:25:21.410 --> 00:25:25.227 laws in South Africa. The whole whole idea with what Nelson 00:25:25.310 --> 00:25:29.157 Mandela, who was a great man, proposed, was that all races should be on an equal 00:25:29.240 --> 00:25:31.827 footing in South Africa. That's the right thing to do. 00:25:31.910 --> 00:25:35.127 Not to replace one set of racist laws with another set of racist laws, which 00:25:35.210 --> 00:25:41.157 is utterly wrong and improper. So the that's the that's the deal that 00:25:41.240 --> 00:25:44.937 all races should be treated equally and there should be no preference given to 00:25:45.020 --> 00:25:48.717 one or the other, whereas there are now 140 laws in South 00:25:48.800 --> 00:25:51.830 Africa that give that basically 00:25:54.590 --> 00:25:58.767 give strong preference to if you're if you're a Black South African and not 00:25:58.850 --> 00:26:01.497 otherwise. And so now I'm in this absurd situation where I 00:26:01.580 --> 00:26:05.577 was born in South Africa but can't get a license to operate in Starlink because 00:26:05.660 --> 00:26:09.287 I'm not Black. Does that seem right to you? Well, it looks like it that, it 00:26:09.370 --> 00:26:11.480 looks like that's about to change. 00:26:12.380 --> 00:26:14.540 I just asked you a question. Please answer. 00:26:14.690 --> 00:26:17.803 Does that seem right to you? Well, those rules were designed to bring - does 00:26:17.886 --> 00:26:19.527 that seem right to you, yes or no? - 00:26:19.610 --> 00:26:23.067 those rules were designed to bring about an era of more economic 00:26:23.150 --> 00:26:26.997 equality in South Africa. And it looks like the government has 00:26:27.080 --> 00:26:31.290 found a way around those rules for you. I asked you a question. 00:26:32.520 --> 00:26:35.207 This is this is your interview. Everyone wants to hear from you. 00:26:35.290 --> 00:26:37.957 I asked you a question, yes or no? Not for me - Racist laws, yes or no? 00:26:38.040 --> 00:26:41.820 Not for me to answer. I have got a question for you about 00:26:42.210 --> 00:26:44.670 about your government works and the amount of savings - You must like racist laws 00:26:44.753 --> 00:26:49.987 then. Why do you like racist laws? This is not for me to answer. 00:26:50.070 --> 00:26:52.747 Come on. Yes it is. Now, you wouldn't be trying to dodge a 00:26:52.830 --> 00:26:55.678 question - You have to ask a question - that's difficult for you to answer. 00:26:55.761 --> 00:26:59.707 I answered my question, now you answer mine. I think if you, I'm sure you can 00:26:59.790 --> 00:27:02.827 have that conversation directly with the South African government if you want to. 00:27:02.910 --> 00:27:05.077 I want to ask you about the total. You like racist laws, I can't believe it. 00:27:05.160 --> 00:27:07.967 That's not good. I want to ask you about the total amount - 00:27:08.050 --> 00:27:11.107 Why do you love racist laws? I want to ask you about the total amount 00:27:11.190 --> 00:27:15.187 that you're planning to save through DOGE's work. Sure. Before the election 00:27:15.270 --> 00:27:17.760 you said it was going to be at least 2 trillion. 00:27:18.030 --> 00:27:23.700 The number currently on doge.gov is 70 billion. 00:27:24.000 --> 00:27:26.910 That's a big change. What happened to the 2 trillion? 00:27:28.380 --> 00:27:30.367 What you expect it to happen immediately? 00:27:30.450 --> 00:27:34.500 Well, is it going to happen because DOGE is supposed to run until next July. 00:27:35.190 --> 00:27:38.140 I mean, your question is absurd in its fundamental premise. 00:27:38.670 --> 00:27:41.907 Are you assuming that that on day, you know, within a few months, 00:27:41.990 --> 00:27:44.467 this is an instant 2 trillion saved? No, I'm not at 00:27:44.550 --> 00:27:47.677 all, I'm just asking is that still your aim, then, is it still your aim to get 00:27:47.760 --> 00:27:51.487 to 2 trillion? So have we not made good progress given 00:27:51.570 --> 00:27:54.847 the amount of time. That's exactly what I'm asking. 00:27:54.930 --> 00:27:59.240 So is it still your aim to go from 170 billion to 2 trillion? 00:28:00.770 --> 00:28:06.500 Of the the ability of DOGE to operate is a function of whether 00:28:07.550 --> 00:28:12.710 the government and this includes the Congress is willing to take our advice. 00:28:14.070 --> 00:28:15.607 We're not the dictators of the government. 00:28:15.690 --> 00:28:19.687 We are the advisors. And so we can we can advise. 00:28:19.770 --> 00:28:22.177 And the progress we've made thus far I think is incredible. 00:28:22.260 --> 00:28:29.260 DOGE team has done incredible work, but the magnitude of the savings is 00:28:29.400 --> 00:28:33.810 proportionate to the support we get from Congress and from the 00:28:35.460 --> 00:28:37.760 executive branch of the government in general. 00:28:38.460 --> 00:28:41.487 So, we're not the dictators, we are the 00:28:41.570 --> 00:28:46.347 advisors. But thus far, for advisors with the 00:28:46.430 --> 00:28:50.000 DOGE team, to their credit, has made 00:28:51.080 --> 00:28:55.787 incredible progress. You've talked about $4 billion a day 00:28:55.870 --> 00:29:00.066 being saved, but that - that's right - that won't get which is, 00:29:00.150 --> 00:29:01.697 and I think everyone can 00:29:01.780 --> 00:29:05.567 agree that combating waste and inefficiency in government is a very 00:29:05.650 --> 00:29:07.757 good thing. But if you add that up, it's not going 00:29:07.840 --> 00:29:10.190 to get to 2 trillion over the lifetime of DOGE. 00:29:13.700 --> 00:29:16.180 I'm sorry. The 4 billion. 00:29:16.330 --> 00:29:19.907 The 4 billion a day, if DOGE is going to run until next July is not going to get 00:29:19.990 --> 00:29:26.847 you to $2 trillion. But you still say it's your aim. 00:29:26.930 --> 00:29:31.237 So we'll take that as read. There's, there's, there's, there's, 00:29:31.320 --> 00:29:35.620 there's what DOGE, I mean, I feel you're somewhat trapped in the 00:29:36.510 --> 00:29:39.940 NPC dialogue tree of a tradition of a journalist. 00:29:40.240 --> 00:29:43.667 So it's difficult when I'm conversing with someone who is trapped in the 00:29:43.750 --> 00:29:47.900 dialogue tree of a conventional journalist because it's like talking to a computer. 00:29:48.610 --> 00:29:53.200 So DOGE is an advisory group. 00:29:53.560 --> 00:29:56.770 We are doing the best we can as an advisory group. 00:29:57.640 --> 00:30:00.690 The progress made thus far as an advisory group is excellent. 00:30:01.150 --> 00:30:03.977 I don't think any advisory group has done better in the history of advisory 00:30:04.060 --> 00:30:09.377 groups to the government. Now we are, we do not make the 00:30:09.460 --> 00:30:15.640 laws, nor do we control the judiciary, nor do we control the executive branch. 00:30:15.910 --> 00:30:19.110 We are simply advisors. In that context, we are doing very well. 00:30:20.350 --> 00:30:24.557 Beyond that, we cannot we can't take action beyond that because 00:30:24.640 --> 00:30:28.040 we are not sort of some sort of imperial dictator of the government. 00:30:28.330 --> 00:30:30.480 There are three branches of government that 00:30:30.760 --> 00:30:34.930 are to some degree opposed to that level of cost savings. 00:30:35.510 --> 00:30:41.697 But nonetheless, let's let's not criticize whether there's 00:30:41.780 --> 00:30:46.072 4 trillion, and instead look at the fact that that 160 billion has been saved 00:30:46.155 --> 00:30:50.237 and more will be saved, too. And as I said, I think everyone can 00:30:50.320 --> 00:30:55.360 agree that cutting waste and indeed fraud in any government and being 00:30:55.510 --> 00:30:58.210 responsible with taxpayers money is a very good thing. 00:30:59.430 --> 00:31:02.347 So - Yes - I can see. I can see that you're proud of that 00:31:02.430 --> 00:31:06.847 work. I do want to ask you about USAID 00:31:06.930 --> 00:31:11.167 and the comments that Bill Gates made the other day, which I and I know 00:31:11.250 --> 00:31:13.267 that you called him - Yeah, he's a huge liar. 00:31:13.350 --> 00:31:16.700 I know, you've said that already. Yeah, it's terrible. I wondered - 00:31:17.730 --> 00:31:21.870 Also - and I'm just - who does Bill Gates think he is to make comments 00:31:22.080 --> 00:31:27.817 about the welfare of children, given that he frequented Jeffrey Epstein. Okay, 00:31:27.900 --> 00:31:32.827 well, he's he's he said he regrets those - 00:31:32.910 --> 00:31:38.296 I mean he's not exactly, I wouldn't trust that guy to babysit my kids - and he's 00:31:38.380 --> 00:31:40.242 spent, he's spent, he's spent a lot of his own money on philanthropy around the world 00:31:40.325 --> 00:31:40.747 over the years. 00:31:40.830 --> 00:31:45.727 My question to you is, have you looked at the data to check if he might be 00:31:45.810 --> 00:31:51.390 right that the cuts to USAID might cost millions of lives? 00:31:53.230 --> 00:31:57.887 Yes, I'd like him to show us any any evidence whatsoever that that is true. 00:31:57.970 --> 00:32:02.507 It's false. The what we have found with USAID cuts 00:32:02.590 --> 00:32:06.910 and by the way, they haven't all been cut, the parts of USAID that were found to be 00:32:07.900 --> 00:32:10.877 even slightly useful, were transferred to the State Department. 00:32:10.960 --> 00:32:13.037 So they've not been deleted, they've simply been transferred to the State 00:32:13.120 --> 00:32:18.440 Department, but many, many times over with USAID and other organizations when 00:32:18.760 --> 00:32:22.487 when they said, oh, well, this is going to help, you know, children or it's 00:32:22.570 --> 00:32:27.947 going to help some disease eradication or something like 00:32:28.030 --> 00:32:29.747 that. And then when we asked for any evidence 00:32:29.830 --> 00:32:34.727 whatsoever, I say, well, please connect us with this group of children so we can 00:32:34.810 --> 00:32:37.097 talk to them and understand more about their issue, 00:32:37.180 --> 00:32:41.427 we get nothing. They don't to even try to prevent, show, 00:32:41.510 --> 00:32:46.997 come up with a with a show orphan, meaning like it's sort of like, 00:32:47.080 --> 00:32:51.117 well, can we at least see a few kids? Like, where are they? 00:32:51.200 --> 00:32:55.100 If they're in trouble, we'd like to talk to them and talk to their caregivers, 00:32:55.360 --> 00:33:00.987 and then we can put that thing as a response because it's what we find is an 00:33:01.070 --> 00:33:04.120 enormous amount of of fraud and graft. Okay, - And actually - 00:33:04.360 --> 00:33:06.099 let me put this example to you - very little. 00:33:06.182 --> 00:33:08.927 of it actually gets to the kids, if anything at all. Okay. 00:33:09.010 --> 00:33:12.917 Let let me put this example to you, because you grew up in South Africa, so 00:33:13.000 --> 00:33:16.637 you will know the impact of HIV AIDS well, and this is why I asked about the 00:33:16.720 --> 00:33:20.897 data. The U.S. led on international efforts to combat 00:33:20.980 --> 00:33:24.647 HIV, AIDS, treatment, prevention. And there's an initiative called 00:33:24.730 --> 00:33:29.777 PEPFAR, which is credited with saving 26 million lives in the last 20 years. 00:33:29.860 --> 00:33:33.347 It was part of the foreign aid freeze. Then there was a limited waiver. 00:33:33.430 --> 00:33:38.357 The services are disrupted. And UNAIDS says if permanently 00:33:38.440 --> 00:33:44.560 discontinued, there will be another 4 million AIDS related deaths by 2029. 00:33:44.770 --> 00:33:51.767 So if you look at that example, which is backed up by data, in 2023, 630,000 00:33:51.850 --> 00:33:56.147 people died of AIDS related illnesses, then perhaps Bill Gates has figures are 00:33:56.230 --> 00:33:58.380 not wrong. Millions of lives could be lost. 00:34:00.400 --> 00:34:03.520 First of all, the program, the the the AIDS 00:34:06.850 --> 00:34:11.980 medication program is continuing. So your fundamental premise is wrong. 00:34:12.220 --> 00:34:15.047 It is continuing. Now, do you have another example? - 00:34:15.130 --> 00:34:19.397 Not, not, - since the one you cited is false - not, Elon not in its entirety. 00:34:19.480 --> 00:34:23.066 This was not in its entirety. What you've cited is false. The program, 00:34:23.149 --> 00:34:27.227 there's a limited waiver. And UNAIDS have said that not all of the 00:34:27.310 --> 00:34:30.467 services that were previously funded by USAID are continuing. 00:34:30.550 --> 00:34:34.050 So that's that's why that's why I put that example to you. Which ones? 00:34:34.150 --> 00:34:36.087 Okay. Well, which ones aren't being funded? 00:34:36.170 --> 00:34:38.957 I'll fix it right now for. Okay. 00:34:39.040 --> 00:34:43.547 Well, actually, they're all on the UNAIDS website, so you'll be able to see 00:34:43.630 --> 00:34:45.467 them. Okay what website? But mostly they are to do with, 00:34:45.550 --> 00:34:49.480 mostly they are to do with prevention. And for example, the rollout of a drug 00:34:50.050 --> 00:34:54.977 called Lenacapavir, which was hailed as one of the biggest breakthroughs against 00:34:55.060 --> 00:34:57.167 AIDS for many years, which came out last year. 00:34:57.250 --> 00:35:01.277 So if you are perhaps I'm sure UNAIDS, UNAIDS would be delighted if you're able 00:35:01.360 --> 00:35:05.477 to look at that again. Yes, but well, if if if in fact this is 00:35:05.560 --> 00:35:07.337 true, which I doubt it is, then we'll fix it. 00:35:07.420 --> 00:35:09.580 Okay, fine. So 00:35:10.630 --> 00:35:13.990 finally, political, your political influence. 00:35:14.710 --> 00:35:21.100 I wondered whether you have decided yet how much you're going to spend on the 00:35:21.340 --> 00:35:26.057 the upcoming midterms. Is it you've you spent a lot more money 00:35:26.140 --> 00:35:28.487 on the last U.S. election than you envisaged when you 00:35:28.570 --> 00:35:33.287 were speaking here three years ago, are you going to continue to to spend at 00:35:33.370 --> 00:35:38.740 that kind of level on future elections? I think 00:35:41.830 --> 00:35:45.700 in terms of political spending, I'm going to do a lot less in the future. 00:35:46.970 --> 00:35:50.900 And why is that? I think I've done enough. 00:35:54.080 --> 00:35:56.180 Is it, is it because of blowback? 00:35:59.020 --> 00:36:02.870 Well, if I see a reason to do political spending in the future, I will do it. 00:36:03.010 --> 00:36:07.267 I do not currently see a reason. What about political influence beyond 00:36:07.350 --> 00:36:10.177 the U.S.? How often do you speak to President 00:36:10.260 --> 00:36:13.660 Putin? I don't speak for President Putin. 00:36:15.370 --> 00:36:19.937 You've never spoken to President Putin? I was on a video call 00:36:20.020 --> 00:36:24.220 with him once about five years ago. Okay, that's the only time - Why would you think 00:36:24.520 --> 00:36:26.860 I speak to President Putin? Oh, you must, 00:36:27.100 --> 00:36:30.077 I get it, you believe the legacy media. Actually, I've heard you I've heard you 00:36:30.160 --> 00:36:32.717 speak about it. For example, in your West Point speech, 00:36:32.800 --> 00:36:37.727 you said, oh, I challenged President Putin to a to, was it an arm wrestle? 00:36:37.810 --> 00:36:41.747 And I know The Wall Street Journal is reported your reported conversations, if 00:36:41.830 --> 00:36:44.237 you're if you're saying they haven't happened other than once, 00:36:44.320 --> 00:36:48.447 I'll take that as read. Is there a worse publication on the face 00:36:48.530 --> 00:36:50.087 of the earth than The Wall Street Journal? 00:36:50.170 --> 00:36:53.450 I wouldn't use that to line up my cage for parrot droppings. 00:36:55.240 --> 00:36:58.660 That that newspaper is the worst newspaper in the world. 00:36:59.380 --> 00:37:02.657 And there's, and if you, if there's one newspaper that 00:37:02.740 --> 00:37:06.140 should be pro-capitalist, it's the one with Wall Street in the name. 00:37:07.020 --> 00:37:11.077 But it isn't, so, I have the very lowest opinion of The Wall 00:37:11.160 --> 00:37:12.967 Street Journal. Absolute nonsense. 00:37:13.050 --> 00:37:16.117 And you clearly believe the tripe that you've written, that you've read in 00:37:16.200 --> 00:37:17.587 those papers. I read. 00:37:17.670 --> 00:37:21.247 I read very widely, and I'm putting these questions to you so that you have 00:37:21.330 --> 00:37:25.147 an opportunity to respond to them, which you are, and and for which we're all 00:37:25.230 --> 00:37:27.097 grateful to hear your responses. Okay. 00:37:27.180 --> 00:37:31.687 We are we are out of time. So you mentioned, you mentioned, me challenging, 00:37:31.770 --> 00:37:36.097 I did so on on the X platform. I challenged Vladimir Putin. 00:37:36.180 --> 00:37:40.387 to single combat - Okay - over the, vut I didn't talk to him. 00:37:40.470 --> 00:37:44.617 That was a post on the X platform. Great, that's why I asked you and 00:37:44.700 --> 00:37:46.867 you've and you've clarified and explain. Thank you. 00:37:46.950 --> 00:37:51.120 That's that's why I was asking whether you have had reported conversations and 00:37:51.540 --> 00:37:53.324 and you said you haven't other than a video call. Yeah, 00:37:53.408 --> 00:37:57.690 the reported the conversations are - typical legacy media lies. Okay. 00:37:57.780 --> 00:38:03.067 Listen, I actually thought I might give Grok the last word, because when I asked 00:38:03.150 --> 00:38:08.317 Grok what your hardest challenge is, it said the strain of managing multiple 00:38:08.400 --> 00:38:13.800 high stake ventures amid financial, regulatory and public relations crises. 00:38:14.190 --> 00:38:19.117 And I wondered whether you recognize that characterization and whether you do 00:38:19.200 --> 00:38:23.010 think that this is a pivotal year in your life. 00:38:25.600 --> 00:38:27.750 Well, every year has been somewhat pivotal. 00:38:28.160 --> 00:38:33.847 And this one is no different. Um, so I mean, in terms of interesting 00:38:33.930 --> 00:38:37.290 things that hopefully are accomplished this year, the 00:38:38.400 --> 00:38:42.030 getting starships to 00:38:43.230 --> 00:38:47.857 be fully reusable so that the that we catch both the booster and the 00:38:47.940 --> 00:38:51.697 ship, which will be the first fully reusable orbital rocket ever in history, 00:38:51.780 --> 00:38:55.027 which is would be a profound breakthrough as the essential 00:38:55.110 --> 00:38:58.717 breakthrough necessary to make life multi-planetary and ultimately become a 00:38:58.800 --> 00:39:04.307 spacefaring civilization. We've got Neuralink, which has now helped 00:39:04.390 --> 00:39:10.777 five patients restore capability using the telepathy 00:39:10.860 --> 00:39:14.310 implants where they're able to control a computer simply by thinking. 00:39:15.330 --> 00:39:22.047 We'll be doing our first patient to restore, to 00:39:22.130 --> 00:39:26.287 restore sight with our Blindsight implant, which is either end of this year or 00:39:26.370 --> 00:39:29.377 early next. In fact, that might that first patient 00:39:29.460 --> 00:39:33.097 might be in UAE since we have a relationship with UAE and the Cleveland 00:39:33.180 --> 00:39:36.210 Clinic there. 00:39:37.860 --> 00:39:42.157 I think what's running on AI fronts, we are close to what you might 00:39:42.240 --> 00:39:47.040 call AGI or digital superintelligence. 00:39:48.930 --> 00:39:51.937 And I think we'll see, we are seeing an explosion in digital 00:39:52.020 --> 00:39:55.257 superintelligence here. And then we've got at Tesla, 00:39:55.340 --> 00:39:58.057 the, we'll be launching unsupervised 00:39:58.140 --> 00:40:01.777 autonomy, basically self-driving cars with no one in them in Austin next 00:40:01.860 --> 00:40:04.590 month. So it's it's a big year for sure. 00:40:06.410 --> 00:40:09.770 Many other things in the works too. 00:40:09.890 --> 00:40:12.710 Okay. I'm a technologist, first and foremost. 00:40:13.430 --> 00:40:17.127 Elon Musk, thank you very much for joining us here at Qatar Economic Forum. 00:40:17.210 --> 00:40:18.043 Thank you.